WIP Improve Baldewyn Coffier & Arnaud/Sabine Matton Sidequests

[pedrwyth]

As Sylvie Bondies is supposed to have lived there for several years, shouldn't she be there permanently? The vcskip could also be made permanent.

Fair comment , since the house is open through the night (during the day she might just be out when you happen by) - so I'll revert her placing from initialization and deal with her dialogue differently to suit and if she is there there does need to be a vcskip too since otherwise why is she telling pchar to leave whilst running open house for all San Juan.

Talking of San Juan #sIsla Muelle# is the town, #sisland_Isla Muelle# is the island. Should it not be "Your girl is now safe in #sIsla Muelle#" or "on #sisland_Isla Muelle#"?

good catch in it should be otherwise changing the previously hardcoded "Spanish colony" isn't properly done.

 

[pedrwyth]

Additional: the version of "initItems.c" contained in that file has the revised weapon prices and stats of the ZIP updates, which are not going into my fixes-only collection. On the other hand, it does not have other items added for the "Woodes Rogers" storyline, which is going in. Could you add your new letter items to this version, please?

No problem

 

[Grey Roger]

Fair comment , since the house is open through the night (during the day she might just be out when you happen by) - so I'll revert her placing from initialization and deal with her dialogue differently to suit and if she is there there does need to be a vcskip too since otherwise why is she telling pchar to leave whilst running open house for all San Juan.

She could have invited her friends to her house. Before you've done the quest, you're not one of her friends.

The main advantage of adding a vcskip is so that you don't get random bandits in the house, with the risk that Sylvie Bondies could get killed in the crossfire, which would mess up the quest. If you don't choose to vcskip the house then you may want to make Sylvie Bondies immortal to prevent that.

It might make sense to close the house at night. She doesn't need the house to be open all the time, she needs her sleep as much as any of the good citizens of San Juan. Find somewhere else to spend the night and visit her next morning.

 

[pedrwyth]

The main advantage of adding a vcskip is so that you don't get random bandits in the house, with the risk that Sylvie Bondies could get killed in the crossfire, which would mess up the quest. If you don't choose to vcskip the house then you may want to make Sylvie Bondies immortal to prevent that.

It might make sense to close the house at night. She doesn't need the house to be open all the time, she needs her sleep as much as any of the good citizens of San Juan. Find somewhere else to spend the night and visit her next morning.

Surprisingly perhaps Sylvie being killed (by an aggressive approach breaking the sidequest) has seemingly been prevented even by pchar by code

LAi_LocationFightDisable(&Locations[n], true);

applied to her house ever since the stock game. One possible glitch the designers did pick up.

Anyway I have restored her to her home from the start, applied a vcskip and closed the house for the night when the other places close.

This all meant minor amendments to Sylvie's dialogue and removal of surplus code from Arnaud's

I have left the later inititems.c in the zip so the whole package is there for anyone using the Sept version but for @Grey Roger's fixes compilation the other version is, of course, in post #102.

I have left any fancy post sidequest dialogue for Sylvie for any future extension and just left the house locked.

 

[Grey Roger]

A couple of problems with the "Sabine Matton" sidequest:

If you play a female character, Sabine sees you as a role-model and wants to join your ship. If you take her as an officer, Arnaud keeps asking if you've seen her. If you say you haven't, the dialog ends. If you say you have, Sabine leaves you. In any case, what you can't do is say you want to talk, which means there is no way to sidequest stuff - and that breaks the "Cargo for Thomas O'Reily" and "Smuggling for Thomas O'Reily" quests. (Additionally, if Sabine is an officer and an active member of your party, you get the amusing situation where Arnaud asks if you've seen Sabine and she's standing right behind you. )

If you ransom Sabine, Arnaud refuses to talk to you any more. Again, that breaks the "Cargo for Thomas O'Reily" and "Smuggling for Thomas O'Reily" quests. In addition, if you attack St. Pierre, you can't loot the store.

@Talisman, @pedrwyth: as this quest is your project, would you like to try to resolve this, or do you want me to try?

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Additionally, if Sabine is an officer and an active member of your party, you get the amusing situation where Arnaud asks if you've seen Sabine and she's standing right behind you.

 

[pedrwyth]

A couple of problems with the "Sabine Matton" sidequest:
@Talisman, @pedrwyth: as this quest is your project, would you like to try to resolve this, or do you want me to try?

I'll have a look before I get too deep into looking at trading, but I'm currently away for a couple of months so nowhere near my modding tools and saved games etc. What's worse is I have stuffed something on my laptop such that it won't even run the games in the series - so will have to persuade my wife to lend me use of her laptop to test anything.

If you play a female character, Sabine sees you as a role-model and wants to join your ship. If you take her as an officer, Arnaud keeps asking if you've seen her. If you say you haven't, the dialog ends. If you say you have, Sabine leaves you. In any case, what you can't do is say you want to talk, which means there is no way to sidequest stuff - and that breaks the "Cargo for Thomas O'Reily" and "Smuggling for Thomas O'Reily" quests. (Additionally, if Sabine is an officer and an active member of your party, you get the amusing situation where Arnaud asks if you've seen Sabine and she's standing right behind you. )

Never tried the added female scenario - have you a useful saved game for testing anything I try?

If you ransom Sabine, Arnaud refuses to talk to you any more. Again, that breaks the "Cargo for Thomas O'Reily" and "Smuggling for Thomas O'Reily" quests. In addition, if you attack St. Pierre, you can't loot the store.

I always thought that was just a fair consequence of your actions but do have long term thoughts (as outlined earlier in the thread) about an extension to replace the storekeeper with a more sympathetic NPC. However it would fit with Arnaud's character to deal with you just for the receipt of that cargo - so an exception based on

if (Characters[GetCharacterIndex("Thomas O'Reily")].quest.first_job == "1" && GetSquadronGoods(PChar,GOOD_SILK)>= 200 && iTest < QUEST_COUNTER)

springs to mind.

Leave that with me for now.

Not sure about how to fix looting but he would obviously be a prime target for your retaliation if you did capture St Pierre.

 

[Grey Roger]

Never tried the added female scenario - have you a useful saved game for testing anything I try?

Unfortunately, no. The easiest method would probably be to start a FreePlay game as a French corsair so that you start at St. Pierre, then use CheatMode to give yourself enough money to lend to Baldewyn Coffier to start the quest. (Or just go straight to Arnaud Matton and accept the job to threaten Baldewyn.)

I always thought that was just a fair consequence of your actions but do have long term thoughts (as outlined earlier in the thread) about an extension to replace the storekeeper with a more sympathetic NPC.

Suggestion: put Baldewyn Coffier into the store. He's told you how Arnaud Matton swindled him, and Sabine has told you how Arnaud mistreated her, so you have enough grounds to tell Arnaud to leave quietly or else. (Though if you hired Baldewyn Coffier as an officer, you may need an alternative candidate.)

Presumably there's some mechanism in the game to detect that the store is being looted because all the prices go to zero. Perhaps use the same mechanism to control Arnaud's dialog so that you can "trade" with him if the colony is being looted. And if the colony belongs to anyone other than France then you'll be the one who did it, so that's another possible way to check if you've defeated the fort. Especially if the colony belongs to Personal because you captured it for yourself.

 

[pedrwyth]

Suggestion: put Baldewyn Coffier into the store. He's told you how Arnaud Matton swindled him, and Sabine has told you how Arnaud mistreated her, so you have enough grounds to tell Arnaud to leave quietly or else. (Though if you hired Baldewyn Coffier as an officer, you may need an alternative candidate.)

Yes that's the long term I had in mind but I want to have a little bit more involved than just threatening in the normal case (like visit Thomas and persuade him to provide evidence about trading, get in with the governor and enlist his support to remove Arnaud etc). For now I will concentrate on allowing the Thomas O'Reily cargo to still be delivered.

Presumably there's some mechanism in the game to detect that the store is being looted because all the prices go to zero. Perhaps use the same mechanism to control Arnaud's dialog so that you can "trade" with him if the colony is being looted.

Yes that's

if (LAi_IsCapturedLocation)

and if you capture the colony you would presumably sort out Arnaud whoever you passed the colony to. So maybe a bit of dialogue about "if you want to keep your head never mind your store you'll change your tune" and then revert to normal trade dialogues (which can be amended slightly if necessary to still seem OK) for future visits. That would still leave the possibility of putting Baldewyn in charge subsequently (if I get round to it).

 

[pedrwyth]

Enclosed are the dialogue files to further tidy this side quest. I have added exceptions for Thomas O'Reily cargo and colony capture if you have made an enemy of Arnaud. Colony capture resets Arnaud to an amicable shopkeeper. If playing a female character you are now blocked from making Sabine an officer (a least until you agree it with Arnaud) to avoid his asking about her when she is in your shore party. I have also added a condition for placing Sabine in the store because some dialogue interactions could place her again when she was already on your ship.

I have only tested these by console commands setting up the scenarios not actual play so may still have missed a lapse in logic.

Finally they are based on August 29th and fixes (ie pre-latest build) so probably need winmerging into the latest.

Incidentally I did see Antoine Lebretton calling me madamoiselle but in the next breath refer to me as a gentleman when in female persona looking at this - but that may well have already been fixed in the gender rationalisation work?

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Brilliant, @pedrwyth!

 

[Grey Roger]

Enclosed are the dialogue files to further tidy this side quest. I have added exceptions for Thomas O'Reily cargo and colony capture if you have made an enemy of Arnaud. Colony capture resets Arnaud to an amicable shopkeeper. If playing a female character you are now blocked from making Sabine an officer (a least until you agree it with Arnaud) to avoid his asking about her when she is in your shore party. I have also added a condition for placing Sabine in the store because some dialogue interactions could place her again when she was already on your ship.

Thanks for that. I'll have to give it a try and see what happens now...

Finally they are based on August 29th and fixes (ie pre-latest build) so probably need winmerging into the latest.

Nothing goes into the post 31st August updates without being checked with WinMerge anyway.

Incidentally I did see Antoine Lebretton calling me madamoiselle but in the next breath refer to me as a gentleman when in female persona looking at this - but that may well have already been fixed in the gender rationalisation work?

No, that one seems to have been overlooked, so thanks for pointing it out. It's fixed now and that is also going into the next update.

 

[Grey Roger]

Suggestion: after Sabine joins you as an officer, she looks like this:

More practical than a town dress for life aboard a ship.

(Face copied from "towngirl1". Everything else from "50_India", with colours changed.)

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Verrry cool, @Grey Roger!

 

[pedrwyth]

So another instalment of this slow growth enterprise.

I have added some "improvements" to the choice of loaning Baldewyn the 10,000. He now takes over one of the two street merchant stalls and starts selling personal items etc. One dialog for during the loan in the first month, one for the repayment and one for after the repayment. I am currently puzzling over how to rework/adapt the store interface to allow him to sell basic provisions from there if Arnaud is no longer trading with you. .I had thought about him moving to sell from a house in the slums but took the easier option in the end.


The long term aim remains for PChar to assist with him supplanting Arnaud ie getting his original business back (if you haven't taken him as an Officer).

A minor tweak to each of Arnaud and Sabine's dialogues.

 

[Grey Roger]

Sounds good!

If I may make a suggestion, don't bother with the store interface yet. Baldewyn now has a small stall but nowhere to store cargo. Perhaps he's used the player's loan to buy out the street trader and is now selling small items as a way to raise money to buy a store and cargo. If you go ahead with your plan to have the player help Baldewyn get the store back, that could be when the player can finally buy provisions again.

Ultimately, perhaps it would be easier not to put Baldewyn into the store! Instead, turn character "Arnaud Matton" into a clone of character "Baldewyn Coffier". The rest of the game system should still work because the same game character is still the storekeeper for St. Pierre. It should also mean that if the player has taken a delivery quest to Arnaud Matton, it will still complete because character "Arnaud Matton" is still there, even if he now looks and sounds like Baldewyn Coffier. (By comparison, if you conquer St. Pierre for a different nation, character "Joseph Claude Le Moigne" is still the governor, now with a new face, name and voice greeting to match his new nation.)

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Uh?
I started this thread?

 

[Grey Roger]

@pedrwyth: Having Baldewyn take over the stall certainly works:

And a month later, he does indeed pay you back as he did before. Meanwhile, as he now has a new job, you have some idea of how he is raising the money to pay you.

The tweaked dialogs for Sabine and Arnaud also make it clearer that Arnaud is not a nice person!

 

[pedrwyth]

If I may make a suggestion, don't bother with the store interface yet. Baldewyn now has a small stall but nowhere to store cargo. Perhaps he's used the player's loan to buy out the street trader and is now selling small items as a way to raise money to buy a store and cargo. If you go ahead with your plan to have the player help Baldewyn get the store back, that could be when the player can finally buy provisions again.

I had already considered the storage considerations which is why for the next phase he would move operations nearer the port. Still using a stall because he can see who is coming and going but plenty of storage potential in the adjacent buildings.

Of course I could just use that location instead of the other location if I don't add in basic trading after all.
However I want Arnaud's decline to be part of a dialogue where he is gradually alienating/banning more and more people from his shop which is why Baldewyn steps in to supply the basics. For game play it allows those who cross him to get essential supplies at Martinique without going as far as needing colony capture but gives some reason the Governor may be concerned about losing potential trade. But I guess we'll see how clumsy my cut down/reworked store interface looks when done and take it from there.

I need to study the Thomas O'reilly stuff to see what (if anything) can be linked in as a crossover without creating too much (or any) forced linear progression of the separate quests , and also what interaction with Sabine could add.

To re-instate Baldewyn my thought at the moment is you need Sabine and have lent Baldewyn the money to have a scenario you can get him into the store but if you capture the colony Arnaud's about face on trading means the Governor has less to worry about with Arnaud, so perhaps not under that circumstance.. but if you install your own Governor....

If you haven't got Sabine with you or recruited Baldewyn (or signed papers against him) there is no re-instatement option - unless perhaps by Force Majeure of taking the colony for yourself when it could be a choice (if I can work that one out too).

Ultimately, perhaps it would be easier not to put Baldewyn into the store! Instead, turn character "Arnaud Matton" into a clone of character "Baldewyn Coffier". The rest of the game system should still work because the same game character is still the storekeeper for St. Pierre. It should also mean that if the player has taken a delivery quest to Arnaud Matton, it will still complete because character "Arnaud Matton" is still there, even if he now looks and sounds like Baldewyn Coffier. (By comparison, if you conquer St. Pierre for a different nation, character "Joseph Claude Le Moigne" is still the governor, now with a new face, name and voice greeting to match his new nation.)

Seems sensible I will try to work out/check how that is done.

 

[Grey Roger]

I had already considered the storage considerations which is why for the next phase he would move operations nearer the port. Still using a stall because he can see who is coming and going but plenty of storage potential in the adjacent buildings.

Of course I could just use that location instead of the other location if I don't add in basic trading after all.

Putting Baldewyn into a stall by the port does have the advantage that you don't need to remove the existing trader, and then presumably put him back when Baldewyn gets the store back.

However I want Arnaud's decline to be part of a dialogue where he is gradually alienating/banning more and more people from his shop which is why Baldewyn steps in to supply the basics. For game play it allows those who cross him to get essential supplies at Martinique without going as far as needing colony capture but gives some reason the Governor may be concerned about losing potential trade. But I guess we'll see how clumsy my cut down/reworked store interface looks when done and take it from there.

I need to study the Thomas O'reilly stuff to see what (if anything) can be linked in as a crossover without creating too much (or any) forced linear progression of the separate quests , and also what interaction with Sabine could add.

At present, Thomas O'Reily's only involvement with Arnaud Matton is the delivery quest. His next quest is the smuggling run to Andre Juliao, and then only if you haven't helped Turpin Cabanel. (There is some unused stuff in Arnaud Matton's dialog about a delivery to Thomas O'Reily, starting with case "node_1". I can't see anything in "Arnaud Matton_dialog.c" leading to "node_1", nor any mention of "node_1" in either "Thomas O'Reily_dialog.c" or "quests_side.c". It may be another trace of Danielle Greene's alternative path through the original game.)

From the player's perspective, being unable to trade at Martinique is a minor inconvenience unless the player was stupid enough to be down to the last day of food or rum upon arrival. Otherwise Barbados is just to the south, or if the player is hostile to Britain then there's Guadeloupe to the north.

You can't count on Arnaud being hostile to the player. Female player characters can recruit Sabine without upsetting him. This also means you can't count on the player meeting Sylvie Bondies.

To re-instate Baldewyn my thought at the moment is you need Sabine and have lent Baldewyn the money to have a scenario you can get him into the store but if you capture the colony Arnaud's about face on trading means the Governor has less to worry about with Arnaud, so perhaps not under that circumstance.. but if you install your own Governor....

If you haven't got Sabine with you or recruited Baldewyn (or signed papers against him) there is no re-instatement option - unless perhaps by Force Majeure of taking the colony for yourself when it could be a choice (if I can work that one out too).

A few suggestions follow; feel free to accept, adapt or completely reject them as you see fit, this is your quest after all...

If you install your own governor then there's the possibility of a simple shortcut. Now you're the boss, you can simply tell Arnaud to get lost, Baldewyn is getting his store back right now. That can work whether or not you recruited Baldewyn; the only difference would be that if Baldewyn is one of your officers, he's not any more.

If you loot the colony then the governor isn't worried about Arnaud's about face, he's worried about you! In any case, just because Arnaud is now trading with you again doesn't mean he's any nicer to anyone else. Your raid may have given the governor another headache but Arnaud's nastiness is still something for him to deal with if it's affecting other trade. (Of course, if the governor gets the idea that Arnaud is the reason you raided the colony, that might give him another motive to want Arnaud replaced...)

Otherwise, the governor isn't worried if Arnaud isn't trading with one captain (you), and if Martinique and Jamaica are on opposite sides of a war then he probably doesn't care about Thomas O'Reily either. But if Arnaud is upsetting other traders, or the local citizens, that's another matter. Your first hint of that could be when Baldewyn repays your loan a month later; perhaps he could comment how many people have been asking why he's not in the store any more and why they've been having their own problems with Arnaud.

Seems sensible I will try to work out/check how that is done.

Another thought. "Cargo for Thomas O'Reily" is heavily dependent on character "Arnaud Matton". An attribute set on "Arnaud Matton" is used to control it. Also, as a result of Martinique becoming Spanish Martinica in "Early Explorers", "Arnaud Matton" gets a new random Spanish name and Sabine's surname is set in "Periods.c" to match his. "Cargo for Thomas O'Reily" therefore uses preprocessed variables to fill in the correct name in both dialog and questbook. If you change "Arnaud Matton" into a clone of "Baldewyn Coffier", the quest should work without any further changes. If you put genuine character "Baldewyn Coffier" into the store, it's going to play merry havoc with this quest!

As to how it's done, my first thought would be something like this:

Characters[GetCharacterIndex("Arnaud Matton")].name = GetMyName(CharacterFromID("Baldewyn Coffier"));
Characters[GetCharacterIndex("Arnaud Matton")].lastname = GetMyLastName(CharacterFromID("Baldewyn Coffier"));
SetModelFromID(CharacterFromID("Arnaud Matton"), Characters[GetCharacterIndex("Baldewyn Coffier")].model;
Characters[GetCharacterIndex("Arnaud Matton")].Dialog.Filename = "Baldewyn Coffier_dialog.c";

Possibly have a new dialog file for Baldewyn as a storekeeper rather than add new trade stuff onto existing "Baldewyn Coffier_dialog.c", in which case obviously you'd use that for the last line. You could probably start by copying the dialog from some other storekeeper who has no special quests - except that many of them are probably already copies of original stock game storekeeper dialogs complete with unwanted quest material!

Using functions 'GetMyName' and 'GetMyLastName' rather than simply "Baldewyn" and "Coffier" means it should work in "Early Explorers" when Baldewyn also has a new random Spanish name.