• New Horizons on Maelstrom
    Maelstrom New Horizons


    Visit our website www.piratehorizons.com to quickly find download links for the newest versions of our New Horizons mods Beyond New Horizons and Maelstrom New Horizons!

Cannons edit

Kikirik007

Kikirik007

Sailor Apprentice
Hi. In AOP2, I would like a real shooting cannons. I dont like that ballistic curve is exaggerated
and guns are shooting to heaven. Everyone knows, or at least any good sailor knows very well what
was the maximum ballistic curve when shooting at longer distances. In Empire Total War and Napoleon, there is a realistic shooting cannons and I like it there right ballistic curve and so on. I enjoy shooting in game Pirates of the Caribbean, but in Build mode, 13 and 14. It is really good because cannons at a greater distance dont shoot to heaven and dont reach the cannonballs on board the ship, but on the body. In FPS aiming wasnt rised up but only to a small amount,it also applies to the motion of aiming to the right and left sides, it was really only optimal. And when the ship shot at me I saw how beautiful the cannonballs fly to me with real ballistic curve, and it was not as in AOP, where it fell from a height, so I took the Build mode. I really like it and I would like to it in the second AOP.Whether in some mode or the original game. I prefer to play without modes. I mean, I've Storm Engine didnt edit and I would shoot the cannons. AOP 2 modified to such a fire that was in Build modes 13 and 14. Would anyone know where I started and I would also expect some guidance. If someone is experienced, it could be the one to let go? I tried it myself but I would like to contact creators Build modes.
Thanks
 
45 degrees is the highest, logical parameter for any ballistic weapon to shoot at max range...this will of course make precision very poor. Like in the Build. I am yet to find a cannon in realistic mode (Gentlemen of Fortune 1.1), that shoots longer at higher degrees - nor will you find a rifled cannon in the 18th century to flatten the ballistic curve ;)
I admit, I´ve never played Empire Total War, but unless you make an "Overload Cannon With Gunpowder That Might Explode"-mod, you will not be able to aim lower at max range?
Or maybe I just dont understand your question :shrug
 
Hi, you were right, you didnt understand the question. I asked, if there is a mode which adjusts a shooting.
In AOP, I would like shooting works the same as it was in Build mode. There was shooting realistic,
certainly more than the Pirates of the Caribbean games. And I asked that if can be edited
shooting from cannons in the Build mode in the AOP. I know history quite well, so you dont have to describe it.
Thanks
 
POTC has had the proper flat trajectory for quite some time. In fact, in options one can choose which cannon mode to use. There is no technical reason for that option to not be in COAS.
 
I personally have no problem with the COAS modded (RTBL) treatment of the range and trajectory solutions. The simple fact is that a huge part of gunnery in those former times was knowing the necessary arch given a desired range and that guns of the 16th through 18th centuries were NOT flat trajectory guns as you are supposing. In modern times we often assume based on the short ranges that we are talking about, that these old smoothbore cannon behaved the same as modern rifled guns using nitro-cellulose propellants.

Old smoothbore guns used blackpowder which produced a dramatically lower velocity and required dramatic ballistic angles and curves to achieve maximum range. Black powder could never produce the power necessary to produce a "flat" trajectory even close to a modern propellant, and even if you increased the amount (which would blow up the gun) with the low velocity exit considering a spherical drag coefficient that would slow the round to target. "the rapid rise in the coefficient of drag of spherical projectiles which doubles between Mach 0.5 (one half the speed of sound, or about 550 feet per second on a standard day) and Mach 1.5 (about 1,700 feet per second on a standard day)" would allow you to actually observe the round with the naked eye....which I have done often in real life.

A common technique in those times to increase range was "firing on the uproll", using the natural motion of the water below them as an extra boost to quadrant firing angle, waiting to fire until the ship had achieved maximum roll upwards.

If you are truly interested in the mathematics behind smoothbore blackpowder cannon, read Chapter 8 from this: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=NSU577HJ

Take a look at this video. Even at only a mere 200 yards, there is an arch seen, especially in slow motion. Imagine the arch at 600 to 1200 yards with the drag coefficient I mentioned.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHYWcBILxgk&feature=related

As for myself, I think it looks fine. Perhaps we should consult Baron Munchausen on the matter....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0e5g13QB5U&feature=related

MK
 
Well, that begs the question. What is your opinion of the two trajectory models in POTC?
 
Hylie Pistoff said:
Well, that begs the question. What is your opinion of the two trajectory models in POTC?
Click to expand...

I think they look fine in POTC. In COAS the visual effect is that the balls can be seen hurled a little higher which is what I think our friend doesn't like.

Also I think he would like to see the same visual damage on the side of the ships that you see in POTC. Honestly, the POTC damage does look better and I would like to import it into COAS, but to be honest I don't really like either visual damage model.

If I could have my way, I would like to see the type of damage you see in POTBS: Visual black holes of various sizes, instead of just patches of bare splintered wood. The wood damage looks like a simple sprite to me, so there should be some kind of superior GM texture we could substitute to make it look more realistic. Ideally a mixture would be nice with more holes than bare wood patches.

I'm sure our uber creative modelers could come up with some really neat substitutions.

MK
 
modernknight1 said:
If I could have my way, I would like to see the type of damage you see in POTBS: Visual black holes of various sizes, instead of just patches of bare splintered wood. The wood damage looks like a simple sprite to me, so there should be some kind of superior GM texture we could substitute to make it look more realistic. Ideally a mixture would be nice with more holes than bare wood patches.
Click to expand...
That's an interesting idea, and it should be pretty easy to do.
I think the texture in question is 'blot.tga', and it appears to contain four different damage 'blots'.
Looking through older versions, it seems to have always been four patches, probably because of how the code works.

I've found three versions so far: one is the stock PotC version, another is what we currently use (I think it's the AoP one, but I'm not sure),
and another is disused, but does seem to resemble the black hole idea you described.
If you want, I can have a go at creating a mixture of these textures to see if I can improve the effect. :shrug
 
Hi. I dont know how to explain my problem anymore! I know a lot informations about trajectories of missiles.
It mattered of the distance for what you want to shoot. But there are unrealistic guns in AOP.Projectile trajectory
is exaggerated too much.You didnt noticed that the cannon balls fly close to heaven? In reality, cannons didnt shoot
to heaven. Only that it was a mortar (the first mortars, used also in the American War of Independence).
Compare the shooting in Build mode 13 or 14 and in AOP games. And you will see the difference. The cannon cant shoot
to heaven as in AOP. Gun range didnt allow it,because in 16-17 century gun range should be approximately 1200 m
(during Napoleon to 3600 m !!!), anyway it only shot at 600-800 meters. In the golden ages Pirates it was less about 400m,
it is logical. Do you already understand what I want? Just in Build mode was shooting real, in the AOP is NOT!
And I would like it in AOP2. Thanks
 
I guess I really don't understand what you mean by "shooting at heaven". In any of my you tube videos, do you see any rounds on an unrealistically high arch, as if the guns are shooting straight up to heaven????? I sure don't.

http://www.youtube.com/user/modernknightone


We on the mod team have no plans to change the cannon visuals any more than we already have. If you want to change it so badly, then you should consider learning the code structure yourself, like we have done over the course of a few years and then doing it yourself until it is to your liking. There are dozens if not hundreds of mini mods in the COAS mods forum that were put together by people that wanted to change the game in little ways that suited their tastes. I recommend you do the same.

Good luck in your quest. I myself am quite satisfied where we have brought the game. The only things in my opinion we still need to do to make it better is get the flag mod, period mod, additional quests, and the neat town/fort locations/layouts available in New Horizons Build 14, ported over to COAS.

Oh yeah,.....and more Dutch ships in the game. ;)

MK
 
Well, I finally got round to improving the damage texture. I almost forgot about it amongst my other projects. :eek:ops
See this post for details.
 
Armada said:
Well, I finally got round to improving the damage texture. I almost forgot about it amongst my other projects. :eek:ops
See this post for details.
Click to expand...

You are the man!!! :onya That looks freakin great mate.

I am going to try this out in my test version of COAS (GOF 1.3).

MK
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top