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Discussion in 'Ship Modeling' started by Armada, Apr 16, 2011.

  1. Hylie Pistof

    Hylie Pistof Curmudgeon Staff Member QA Tester Storm Modder

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    Sorry about my silence.

    It would take a modeler to create a lateen with another boom. So we are stuck with trying to make them right more than they are wrong.

    More pictures? Sure!
     
  2. Armada

    Armada Sea Dog Staff Member Administrator Project Manager 3D Artist Storm Modder

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    Surely you could just use the 'XX -1' trick, which is what makes spankers behave correctly?
    That would only work for lateens modelled straight (same as spankers), mind you. For angled ones, it's a different story.
     
  3. Hylie Pistof

    Hylie Pistof Curmudgeon Staff Member QA Tester Storm Modder

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    That -1 trick should help with some lateens. It's easy to position them on one side of the mast or the other. The trick is to get the bottom to stay away from the mast at all times. And get them pointing more or less in the right direction.

    Recently in one game I was sailing the Revenge, with 4 masts and 2 lateens, and the lateens were a mess. Admittedly they are in a very tight place, but it was a case of right more than wrong.

    Now I'm sailing a caravel with 4 masts and 2 lateens, and those lateens are great.

    Here's the kicker. The Revenge lateens are straight and the caravel's are turned. :rolleyes:
     
  4. Hylie Pistof

    Hylie Pistof Curmudgeon Staff Member QA Tester Storm Modder

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    I hope you are still lurking around here Post Captain. I finally got to try your spanker suggestions. Whatcha think?
     
  5. Post Captain

    Post Captain Seamanship Advisor Coordinator QC Advisor Storm Modder

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    I kind of got distracted over the past weeks.
    That rigging all looks pleasantly familiar... well done.
    You still need a peak halyard, but that might be a little cluttered ingame. I can post more pictures of different vessel's halyards, possibly over the weekend. (I'll actually do it this time)
     
  6. Hylie Pistof

    Hylie Pistof Curmudgeon Staff Member QA Tester Storm Modder

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    I only put a single peak halyard line on her because multiple lines with no pulleys look lame. I suppose a larger sail would need them though.
     
  7. Post Captain

    Post Captain Seamanship Advisor Coordinator QC Advisor Storm Modder

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    Trust me, even the small ones need a system of pulleys. (It still hurts to set them, even with the mechanical advantage)
    But you do have some creative license here, if it doesn't look as good.

    A side note: on larger vessels where the boom extends far aft over the stern, the sheet would be rigged as far aft on the boom as possible, for leverage. I haven't seen many larger early 18th c. vessels, but I have it on the authority of The PIlgrim's training master, this guy: http://www.theknotguy.com/
    (You can tell he knows what he's talking about because of the beard)
    I believe that this would have applied mainly to frigates and ships of the line.
     
  8. Hylie Pistof

    Hylie Pistof Curmudgeon Staff Member QA Tester Storm Modder

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    Ok, here's another attempt on that European Bark. No pulleys, but the ropes are there.

    The knot guy! I used to know how to work with rope, doing cutting, splicing, and tying but it's a forgotten art these days.

    I'm not quite sure I know what you're talking about, but that boom couldn't be rigged farther aft because of the lanterns.
     
  9. Post Captain

    Post Captain Seamanship Advisor Coordinator QC Advisor Storm Modder

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    I kind of like the revised halyard, since that's what I'm used to looking up (or down, when I'm aloft) and seeing.
    The sheets shouldn't be impeded much by more authentic models of the proper time period rigged further aft- there wouldn't be lanterns there in the first place. But the ships other than the ones I described in the last post are perfect as you have them.

    Edit: the present sheet rigging is fine, based on rigging diagrams of the real HMS Surprise. It's too hard to tell by looking at pictures of the Constitution and Victory, so I believe the alternate rigging I discussed may have been fairly uncommon. I have also confirmed that 'Hms' Rose-Surprise (Roseprise?) Is rigged like you have the other vessels rigged. I beleive the sheets may be kept as they are at present.
     
  10. Hylie Pistof

    Hylie Pistof Curmudgeon Staff Member QA Tester Storm Modder

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  11. Armada

    Armada Sea Dog Staff Member Administrator Project Manager 3D Artist Storm Modder

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    Thanks Hylie, good catch with the potential CTD causes! :cheers
     
  12. Captain Armstrong

    Captain Armstrong Shipbuilding Coordinator Staff Member Coordinator 3D Artist Storm Modeller Storm Modder

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    does modelling the spanker "inside out with reverse lighting" mean reversing the normals and checking 'opposite' in renders stats?
     
  13. Armada

    Armada Sea Dog Staff Member Administrator Project Manager 3D Artist Storm Modder

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    I wrote that first post a long time ago, before I was acquainted with Maya, so I know it's not very clear. :facepalm

    I think the actual solution is just to check 'Opposite' in Render Stats. I haven't done much testing to confirm that myself, but other modellers have said something to that effect.
     
  14. Armada

    Armada Sea Dog Staff Member Administrator Project Manager 3D Artist Storm Modder

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    I couldn't think of anywhere else to post this, but it might be important for future reference:

    Earlier I was exporting the components of the Trinity model to GM format, and it was all going well until I got to the yards, which wouldn't open in TOOL once exported.
    This problem is a long-standing mystery, and before I've always used a workaround of sorts, but doing so for about 10 yard models would get very tedious.
    So, I went and tried as many ways I could think of to get the damn things to export properly, and long story short, I might have found a working solution. :dance

    What I did was select a yard and go to 'Edit Polygons -> Split Vertex', deselect the yard, and then select it again and go to 'Edit Polygons -> Merge Vertices'.
    This resulted in a smaller number of faces, vertices and edges than the yard originally had, but it looked exactly the same as before. o_O
    For some reason, that led to a successful export, with TOOL opening the file properly.

    I reckon there must have been some unnecessary faces, vertices and edges that were somehow created in the original modelling process, but I still can't be 100% sure.
    In any case, this might be a good solution to prevent bad exports in future...
     

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