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Major breakthrough with Akella

Peter Willemoes

Peter Willemoes

Corsair
Storm Modder
I have been working the last couple of months on getting in contact with first of all Akella, the developer of PotC and since everybody else in the business who could help us out. Most times, I got no replies at all and it all seemed like the Russians was ignoring us, although knowing of our work.
That was not the case. A couple of days ago, I finally got a reply from the vice-president of Akella, Dmitry Akhipov, who was most surprised of discovering a western modding group, that actually was modding one of their games, and an old one indeed! He forwarded his reply to the the specialist on mod making on the Storm engine, Edward Zaitsev, who also happens to be the head of the old and most respected modding team SliB, now Seaward.ru, from whom I just got a response.

EDIT: My personal ethics conflicted with posting Edwards personal mail here. In short, he suggest we (Seaward.ru and the Pirates Ahoy! Build Mod) should cooperate and futhermore states, that we are using the wrong tools for modmaking. He have got the stuff we need to mod PotC, but needs to refer with Mr. Akhipov before he hands them over to us.

Also, he suggests that we move on to the new game developed by Seaward.ru, <a href="http://kotaku.com/gaming/game-announcements/akellas-city-of-abandoned-ships-pirated-323695.php" target="_blank">Corsairs: City of Abandoned Ships</a>, and additionally states (citing) "We will not regret it".

Thats hitting two flies in one bash! Cintact with Akella _AND_ seaward.ru made! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" />
What we do and respond from now on is up to you, guys..
 
this calls for: <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/monkeydance.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":mi" border="0" alt="monkeydance.gif" />
 
I personally think it would be awesome if we could cooperate. It has always been my biggest dream for the game if all the work that has been done in the past could be joined and used: All the good stuff from PotC, the SLiB mod, the Build mod, AoP and all Russian sequels being put in one game. However, there are some problems with that. When AoP was released, just about the entire Build modding team agreed to stick to PotC rather than abandon all our work on the Build mod and starting all over with AoP. Now if we would move on to modding Corsairs: City of Abandoned Ships, we would have this same problem again.

I personally think that we should stick to PotC, unless all our good stuff can be ported to the Storm 2.5 engine without actually losing any good stuff. Of course many people here, me included, don't actually <i>have</i> AoP at all. Another problem would be that our moddign community has a rather unconventional way of working: Everybody contributes what he or she wants and we put it together. There are no real deadlines. Things are done when they're done. Also there is no main modding "plan" involving the goals we are pursuing. Of course there is a general idea of what we want, but not much of a real focus. Which in our case is, I think, a good thing.

How about we write up an explanation about our mod, our modding team, what we have done, what we are doing, what we want to do and how we work? We'll need to figure out the best way of working together. We don't really want to end up losing our good Build mod, our special way of modding or to become part of some sort of serious modding effort. That might put a lot of the current members off. After all: This is not a very serious community, is it? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rolleyes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":rolleyes:" border="0" alt="rolleyes.gif" />

In any case: This is good news! If only Akella could help us using the proper modding tools, that already would be a great help. Then they, in turn, could promote our mod, which again could increase income from the PotC game for them.
 
<!--quoteo(post=225543:date=Dec 12 2007, 06:32 PM:name=Morgan Terror)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Morgan Terror @ Dec 12 2007, 06:32 PM) [snapback]225543[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->this calls for: <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/monkeydance.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":mi" border="0" alt="monkeydance.gif" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

<!--quoteo(post=225581:date=Dec 12 2007, 09:15 PM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Dec 12 2007, 09:15 PM) [snapback]225581[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->In any case: This is good news! If only Akella could help us using the proper modding tools, that already would be a great help. Then they, in turn, could promote our mod, which again could increase income from the PotC game for them.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

<i>"Fifthteen men on the Dead Man's Chest, Hey yo ho and a bottle of rum!"</i> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/danse1.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":dance" border="0" alt="danse1.gif" /> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/par-ty.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":cheers" border="0" alt="par-ty.gif" />

And Morgan this indeed calls this but not just this but THIS!: <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/monkeydance.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":mi" border="0" alt="monkeydance.gif" /> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/monkeydance.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":mi" border="0" alt="monkeydance.gif" /> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/monkeydance.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":mi" border="0" alt="monkeydance.gif" /> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/monkeydance.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":mi" border="0" alt="monkeydance.gif" /> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/monkeydance.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":mi" border="0" alt="monkeydance.gif" />
MONKEYS! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/piratesing.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":shock" border="0" alt="piratesing.gif" /> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/danse1.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":dance" border="0" alt="danse1.gif" />
 
It calls for discussion as well. Thoughts, please! MANY of them, if possible! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/whistling.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":wp" border="0" alt="whistling.gif" />
 
What me can say? ..well me can say that we NEED THOSE RIGHT TOOLS/PROGRAMS FOR MAKING NEW SHIPS!!! in other words we need a WORKING program to replace the
current crappy-buggy-blow-yerself-up Inez Diaz ship corruption tool. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile2.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":))" border="0" alt="smile2.gif" />

It would be VERY GREAT to get all those right equipment for finishing our Build Mod and getting rid of this common reversed lighting effect on added non-potc ships ONCE AND FOR ALL! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/slap.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":slap" border="0" alt="slap.gif" />
 
Don't promise yourself from that "cooperation" too much...

If we are going to drop PotC for AoP you lost me. I won't buy AoP simply because:
1. I hardly see any improvement in AoP in comparaison to PotC (or even old Sea Dogs). I don't count graphics, because it isn't most important. AoP has some interesting ships, but not all (for example, AoP frigate is very poor in my opinion). Gameplay is far worse than PotC, not mentionig Sea Dogs!
2. I don't like it's protecting method (<i>StarForce</i>) which I decided to boycott. Permanently. Dot.

pirate_kk
 
You make some very valid points. That is the reason why we need to discuss this. Very seriously. I really don't want to lose <b>any</b> of our good and hard work, nor do I want to put off <b>any</b> members. We need to be able to come up with a way in which to do this "cooperation" thing without compromising any of those things. I am also rather sceptical about moving onto AoP. Now if Akella could modify the Storm 2.5 engine to work with our game: Great! Improved sea graphics and such would not hurt. But completely dropping everything we ever did and just trying to help Akella for free on something they will make money on doesn't sound right to me.

I think what we would mainly want is:
- The proper modding tools
- Access to the hardcoded stuff from the MODULES folder
- Running our game on the Storm 2.5 engine

If possible I would like to see our modding work joined with AoP and all Russian modding work, using the best of all worlds, in which case I wouldn't mind Akella making money from <i>my</i> work. This because at least it would make a better pirate game than we could ever make on our own. But not at the cost of putting off <b>any</b> members. And also with the agreement of everyone. And, of course, every modder should be free to say NO to his work being commercially used.
Many people are bound to have objections to doing this, so it is most likely that this will never happen and I would be fine by that. Keeping the Build mod to the Build mod would be good enough for me. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/yes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":yes" border="0" alt="yes.gif" />

Of course the whole Akella making money from our work would also be a major thing to consider. What would we think about Akella selling our finished modpack as add-on to the original PotC? Or as new standalone game? Or as add-on for AoP? Or putting our work into another commercial add-on for AoP? Some major things to consider here.
 
Yeah... <i>StarForce</i> is very strict copy protection system, which of course has been already circumvented <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

Anyway, as of right now, our main strength is the ability to produce some amazing scipts, which add additional stuff to the game. Besides that, our other addition (self-created textures and models) are kinda limited.

But it certainly goes without saying that we could use some proper tools <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

And I also wouldn't want to move to the newest engine, simply because it offers more bells and whistles, exotic shaders and stuff... Storm 2.5 is quite adequate for satysfying my need for prettiness, thank you very much <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" />
 
although i'm totally for better graphics, what of the users who can't use such kind of graphics, like me? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" /> well, i guess it might not matter that much in that perspective after all. i'll see. anyway, i don't really have an ideas for this. i can't really imagine where to start or what to say. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />
 
I have no complaints about a company making money off work I've done for free. I've done this in the past several times. Sometimes it even gets your name in the game credits. Other people may not like it, however. To each his own.

However, I will not have anything to do with a program that uses Starforce copy protection. After my experience with Silent Hunter 3, I will not install anything on my computer that uses it. I refuse to buy a program that uses it. They can use anything I've made that they find useful, but I will not be creating anything new for them if they use Starforce.

I bought Silent Hunter 3, which uses Starforce, when I bought a new computer that had Windows XP. I was somewhat surprised when XP crashed more often than Windows ME ever did. Then I found out about Starforce, and had the devil's own time getting rid of it. But after I finally got Starforce off my system, XP became stable. Silent Hunter 3 still ran just fine with a crack to eliminate the CD, and therefore bypass Starforce.

Don't take my word for it. Google Starforce and see what comes up.

I don't see any reason to drop PotC completely. If you turn control over to another group, don't expect them to happily accept and include every possible mod you can make. Somewhere in their chain of command there will be a person whose sole responsibility (it will appear to you) is to tell you, "No, we won't use that." Be prepared to deal with that. And don't expect them to use switches to turn mods on and off. That kind of thing works well for an informal modding effort like we have here; it won't fly in a more professional environment.

All that being said, it's very satisfying to see your work used in a professional game. It's even more satisfying to see your name in the credits. I'd say go for it, but don't abandon the current efforts with PotC.

Hook
 
I think we should all try and decide on what we do and don't want. These would be (some of) my wishes:

<i>I do want (in order of importance):</i>
1) Proper modding tools
2) Access to the hardcoded stuff from the MODULES folder
3) Running our game on the Storm 2.5 engine
4) Joining all AoP and PotC content together in the best pirate game ever made (wishful thinking, I know)

<i>I don't want (in no particular order):</i>
- Losing <i>any</i> of our good work
- Putting off <i>any</i> members
- Losing the way this community works: democratic, everybody is welcome to join, no deadlines, etc.
- Making money of my voluntary work in any way

My <i>I don't want</i>'s are much more important in this respect than my <i>I do wants</i>. I would not trade getting ALL my <i>I do wants</i> realised for losing only ONE of my <i>I don't wants</i>.

<!--quoteo(post=225599:date=Dec 12 2007, 10:03 PM:name=Kazeite)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Kazeite @ Dec 12 2007, 10:03 PM) [snapback]225599[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yeah... <i>StarForce</i> is very strict copy protection system, which of course has been already circumvented <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Of course we don't want any Starforce involvement. At all. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/no.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":no" border="0" alt="no.gif" />

<!--quoteo(post=225599:date=Dec 12 2007, 10:03 PM:name=Kazeite)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Kazeite @ Dec 12 2007, 10:03 PM) [snapback]225599[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Anyway, as of right now, our main strength is the ability to produce some amazing scipts, which add additional stuff to the game. Besides that, our other addition (self-created textures and models) are kinda limited.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->As far as coding is concerned, there is a lot of cool stuff we can do and a lot of cool stuff we do. We don't have many coders active though, so work in this respect is going rather slow. It seems to me that self-created textures are also one of the major assets of our modpack: see our ship, characacter and town retextures. On the other hand, as soon as things go 3D, we are very limited. We can't properly add ships into the game, we can't make new characters, we can't make new locations. We can only adequately modify existing stuff.

<!--quoteo(post=225599:date=Dec 12 2007, 10:03 PM:name=Kazeite)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Kazeite @ Dec 12 2007, 10:03 PM) [snapback]225599[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->But it certainly goes without saying that we could use some proper tools <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Beyond a shadow of a doubt. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/yes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":yes" border="0" alt="yes.gif" />

<!--quoteo(post=225599:date=Dec 12 2007, 10:03 PM:name=Kazeite)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Kazeite @ Dec 12 2007, 10:03 PM) [snapback]225599[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And I also wouldn't want to move to the newest engine, simply because it offers more bells and whistles, exotic shaders and stuff... Storm 2.5 is quite adequate for satysfying my need for prettiness, thank you very much <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->What do you mean here? Are you happy enough with our Storm 2.0 graphics as it is? Or would you like our game to be able to run on the AoP Storm 2.5? Personally I would like the better graphics of the Storm 2.5 engine, but it is not exactly very important to me.

<!--quoteo(post=225602:date=Dec 12 2007, 10:15 PM:name=Morgan Terror)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Morgan Terror @ Dec 12 2007, 10:15 PM) [snapback]225602[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->although i'm totally for better graphics, what of the users who can't use such kind of graphics, like me? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" /> well, i guess it might not matter that much in that perspective after all. i'll see. anyway, i don't really have an ideas for this. i can't really imagine where to start or what to say. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->That actually does matter. I think that if Akella would be willing to adapt the AoP Storm 2.5 engine to our game and you would be unwilling or unable to use it, you could probably just stick the "old" PotC ENGINE.exe into your game and play all latest mods anyway.
 
Ok, to clarify, <b>Pieter</b>, I do agree with your points, and I could support switching to Storm 2.5, but not above. I merely thought that Storm engine has evolved beyond 2.5 <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />
 
I don't really know if it has. Last thing I knew was Storm 2.5 for AoP. They might've gone above now. Why would you not want to go any further than 2.5? Based on what I know of any higher versions (nothing), I wouldn't have a problem with it, so I'd like to see your views on that one. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rolleyes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":rolleyes:" border="0" alt="rolleyes.gif" />
 
Pieter, you took the words right out of my mouth... my thoughts exactly. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile2.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":))" border="0" alt="smile2.gif" />
 
As far as I understand this it's not Akella that has proposed a cooperation but a russian modder group, and also they're not suggesting to switch to AOP, but to Corsairs: City of Abandoned Ships, which, I believe, is *their* mod (I may be wrong about that, though).
About tools let's add that there used to be a Maya plugin around in these forums here, too, only many people don't have Maya.
Anyway, russian modders have in the past shared some magnificient work, so a cooperation would certainly be worthwhile.
<img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />
Best of luck

Inez
 
INEZ! Nice seeing you again! Thanks you very much for dropping in! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/bow.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":bow" border="0" alt="bow.gif" />

We contacted them through Akella. <i>Corsairs: City of Abandoned Ships</i> is a modpack made by the Russian modders that has been commercially released in Russia and will be commercially released in the western world as well in due time. See <a href="http://en.akella.com/News.aspx?id=441" target="_blank">here</a>.
 
Wow... Inez Dias? Here? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

Anyway, I wouldn't want to go above 2.5, because I see no reason to. 2.5 is already pretty enough for my tastes. Any additional graphical "improvements" are in my opinion unecessary. For example, I can see on screenshots that <i>"Age of Pirates: Captain Blood</i>" supports and uses normal mapping. To fully utilize such option I'd have to build high-poly version of every low-poly model I do, and for what? For extra graphical whistle which increases minimum hardware specifications? Look at PotBS team - they were using normal maps at the early developement stage, but they have decided to drop them <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />
 
Age of Pirates: Captain Blood is a completely different game and a completely different engine. It has nothing to do with the "real" Age of Pirates: Caribbean Tales, except it is also a pirate game made by Akella.
 
Wow! All kinds of old modders in here, makes me all nostalgic! I will be honest, I love this community( even though I don't get to hang out here as must as I would like) and I love pirate games. Anything that would further either of these would be great in my opinion. We would likely get alot more exposure by getting involved in a professional work which could really help out the community. Obviously, we would need to get a better idea of what they mean by working together, because that can mean alot of different things. I have no problem with any my stuff being used. If we put our name to it, it had better be STABLE! This community has a good reputation for building a stable mod, and I would hate to see that ruined because we attach ourselves to some slipshod modpack.
 
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