1. Dismiss Notice
  2. GOG.com logo

    Thanks to YOUR votes, GOG.com now sells:
    - Sea Dogs - Sea Dogs: Caribbean Tales
    - Sea Dogs: City of Abandoned Ships

    Vote now to add Pirates of the Caribbean to the list!

    Dismiss Notice
  3. Under the Crossbones Podcast

    A Pirate Podcast with Interviews
    Music, Comedy and all things Pirate!

    - Episode Guide - About - Subscribe -
    - Twitter - Facebook - iTunes - Android -
    - Youtube - Fill the Coffers -

    Dismiss Notice
  4. New Horizons logo

    Quick links for PotC: New Horizons
    - Download latest version
    - Wiki - FAQ - Report bugs here
    - ModDB profile

  5. GOF logo

    Quick links for AoP2: Gentlemen of Fortune 2
    - Downloads and info
    - Historical Immersion Supermod
    - ModDB Profile

Dismiss Notice
New to the forum?
Please take a moment to read our Welcome Message and Forum Rules.

New Santiago

Discussion in 'Bartolomeu (Bartolomeu o' Portugues)' started by Grey Roger, Jun 8, 2015.

  1. Grey Roger

    Grey Roger Sea Dog Staff Member Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    6,413
    At the end of "The Cartagena Firework", the heavy war galleon which you captured at Cartagena is repainted and renamed to New Santiago. As it happens, I had another similar ship which I'd taken off the Spanish some time ago and berthed at Sao Jorge, so I got to compare the two.

    The New Santiago has less crew and HP than the regular version, and it's tier 3 whereas the regular version is tier 2. This isn't surprising when you look up "SP_BattleGalleon" and "PiratBattleGalleon" in "Ships_init.c". Is there a reason for the difference? Also, is there a reason why it's set to be Portuguese design when it's supposed to be a repaint of the Spanish ship you captured in Cartagena?
     
  2. Pieter Boelen

    Pieter Boelen (Not So) Old Seadog Staff Member Administrator Storm Modder Hearts of Oak Donator

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Messages:
    66,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Maritime Research: Project Engineer (Analysis)
    Location:
    Wageningen, The Netherlands
    Is the PiratBattleGalleon a quest only ship? I can't remember now.
     
  3. Grey Roger

    Grey Roger Sea Dog Staff Member Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    6,413
    The basic "SP_BattleGalleon" has the usual "refShip.period" and "refShip.<nation>" lines in its definition, belongs exclusively to Spain, and can be encountered in random Spanish fleets. That's where I got my first one. Incidentally, look at the thread San Martin galleon; the ship shown there looks similar to this one, except that it's a plain wooden hull whereas "SP_BattleGalleon" has a red and white stripe along the side and a row of shields each side of the stern.

    "PiratBattleGalleon" has no "refShip.period" or "refShip.<nation>" lines, but does have
    Code:
    refShip.CanBuy     = false; //Quest Ship!!
    refShip.CanEncounter   = false; //Quest Ship!!
    so it probably is a quest only ship. ;) I've no idea if it shows up in any other quests. The final log entry in "The Cartagena Firework" includes this:
    "I asked to my crew to paint my colours in my 'New Santiago'."
    So it's presumably supposed to be the same ship you captured in Cartagena with a new colour scheme - the stripe is red and black, and the shields look similar to some of the Personal and Pirate flags. No mention is made of modifying the ship or sacking some of the crew, which is why I wonder about the different specification in "Ships_init.c" and the fact that it is set to be Portuguese design.
     
  4. Pieter Boelen

    Pieter Boelen (Not So) Old Seadog Staff Member Administrator Storm Modder Hearts of Oak Donator

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Messages:
    66,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Maritime Research: Project Engineer (Analysis)
    Location:
    Wageningen, The Netherlands
    Indeed it sounds like indeed she should be getting the same stats then.
    But that is made complicated by the random element in the normal "SP_BattleGalleon". :facepalm
     
  5. Grey Roger

    Grey Roger Sea Dog Staff Member Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    6,413
    Obviously you won't get exactly the same ship. But what's puzzling me is, why intentionally give it different stats in the definition, and why make it Portuguese design when it's Spanish design? Basically, barring any objection from @Bartolomeu o Portugues I'm inclined to edit "Ships_init.c" to give it the same baseline stats as "SP_BattleGalleon", then change "quests_reaction.c" to read
    Code:
    GiveShip2Character(Pchar,"PiratBattleGalleon","New Santiago",-1,SPAIN,true,true);
     
  6. Pieter Boelen

    Pieter Boelen (Not So) Old Seadog Staff Member Administrator Storm Modder Hearts of Oak Donator

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Messages:
    66,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Maritime Research: Project Engineer (Analysis)
    Location:
    Wageningen, The Netherlands
    I don't have any objections, but it is up to Bartolomeu in the end, of course.
     
  7. Bartolomeu o Portugues

    Bartolomeu o Portugues Buccaneer Storm Modeller Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    2,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    web developer
    Location:
    Viana do Castelo - Portugal
    You're right. Don't change anything before asking me.
    Could you confirm the ship is a bit faster and maneuverable than the regular one? Because, it should...

    Since the changes are more than just a new painting (the new stats), I also decided to change the design nationality.
     
  8. Grey Roger

    Grey Roger Sea Dog Staff Member Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    6,413
    "Fast" and "manoeuvrable" are not words I would associate with that ship. xD It might be a bit less slow and clumsy than the stock model, but I've also got a fast war galleon stashed at Sao Jorge for when I want something fast and manoeuvrable.

    Perhaps the questbook text should be changed to indicate that the New Santiago has had a more extensive refit than just a new coat of paint?
     
  9. Bartolomeu o Portugues

    Bartolomeu o Portugues Buccaneer Storm Modeller Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    2,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    web developer
    Location:
    Viana do Castelo - Portugal
    Yes, about the questbook text change.
    Since my PC isn't still repaired and I cannot check that. Could you confirm the ship is a bit less slow and clumsy than the stock model ?:D
     
  10. Pieter Boelen

    Pieter Boelen (Not So) Old Seadog Staff Member Administrator Storm Modder Hearts of Oak Donator

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Messages:
    66,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Maritime Research: Project Engineer (Analysis)
    Location:
    Wageningen, The Netherlands
  11. Grey Roger

    Grey Roger Sea Dog Staff Member Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    6,413
    Looking at the numbers, the New Santiago does indeed have slightly higher speed and turn ratings. For practical purposes, there's no real difference though. Partly because the New Santiago still has trouble catching up with a group of Spanish merchants, my favourite prey; and partly because also stashed in Sao Jorge is my fast war galleon, which is the ship I normally use except when a quest ship like the original Santiago is likely to be needed again for the quest. (There is no way Gauthier Thomassin is getting the fast war galleon!) That thing completely outclasses both versions of battlegalleon. New Santiago is more like a battleship, useful against targets which are even slower and clumsier, e.g. forts. (And for that, the Spanish navy have kindly "donated" a real battleship, now also berthed at Sao Jorge. :D)
     
  12. Bartolomeu o Portugues

    Bartolomeu o Portugues Buccaneer Storm Modeller Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    2,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    web developer
    Location:
    Viana do Castelo - Portugal
    Yes, it's intentional. The idea was to give to the player a ship which could fight better the forts.
     
  13. Pieter Boelen

    Pieter Boelen (Not So) Old Seadog Staff Member Administrator Storm Modder Hearts of Oak Donator

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Messages:
    66,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Maritime Research: Project Engineer (Analysis)
    Location:
    Wageningen, The Netherlands
    Do the ingame stats also reflect the deliberate change?
    Because possibly the PiratFastGalleon has a .unique attribute which means that she gets the exact stats from ships_init.c in the game.
    But the other ship will definitely be randomized with the national modifiers included.
     
  14. Hylie Pistof

    Hylie Pistof Curmudgeon Staff Member QA Tester Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2010
    Messages:
    13,768
    Gender:
    Male
    Just for historical reference, the San Martin was the flagship of the Spanish Armada and engaged in many battles. In one battle while the fleet was in harbor on the Flemish coast the San Martin and 3 other ships were assigned the task of defending them from the English attack. Outnumbered 12 to 1 the San Martin was the only one to survive that battle and then led the Armada around Scotland and Ireland back to Spain. She was slow but powerful.
     
  15. Bartolomeu o Portugues

    Bartolomeu o Portugues Buccaneer Storm Modeller Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    2,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    web developer
    Location:
    Viana do Castelo - Portugal
    An unique attribute? How?
     
  16. Pieter Boelen

    Pieter Boelen (Not So) Old Seadog Staff Member Administrator Storm Modder Hearts of Oak Donator

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Messages:
    66,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Maritime Research: Project Engineer (Analysis)
    Location:
    Wageningen, The Netherlands
    refShip.unique = true; ensures the ship stats in the game are the same as in ships_init.c without any randomization being applied.
     
  17. Grey Roger

    Grey Roger Sea Dog Staff Member Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    6,413
    There is no "unique" attribute" for "PirateBattleGalleon", though both "refShip.CanBuy" and "refShip.CanEncounter" are set to false, which presumably means it can't be for sale in any shipyard and can't be found in a random group on the worldmap. (Not that I can confirm either since I don't buy ships, "PirateBattleGalleon" is listed as Portuguese and I ignore Portuguese ships on the worldmap. :D) There is a "refShip.unique" attribute for the the Satanist frigate, by comparison.
     
  18. Pieter Boelen

    Pieter Boelen (Not So) Old Seadog Staff Member Administrator Storm Modder Hearts of Oak Donator

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2004
    Messages:
    66,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Maritime Research: Project Engineer (Analysis)
    Location:
    Wageningen, The Netherlands
    Then indeed the stats will be randomized for both. "Unique" refers only to the randomizing of stats.
    The CanBuy/CanEncounter ones actually prevent the ship from showing up at random, but don't influence the stats.
    Since they both don't have "unique", they should probably indeed be of the same nation design to ensure they are randomized in a similar way.
    Then it still cannot be guaranteed to be "better" than the original, so therefore the differences between the two should be large enough to notice.
     
  19. Grey Roger

    Grey Roger Sea Dog Staff Member Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    6,413
    From what @Bartolomeu o Portugues said, the refit to New Santiago is more than just cosmetic. The national differences between Portugal and Spain, and the specific differences between "SP_BattleGalleon" and "PirateBattleGalleon", reflect this. What is needed, then, is the change to the questbook, which at the moment merely indicates a repaint.

    So, @Bartolomeu o Portugues, how about this:
    Instead of "I asked to my crew to paint my colours in my 'New Santiago'" (which is in there now)
    How about "The shipyard has refitted my 'New Santiago' making it more suitable as a raider" (would explain the new stats and the change of design nationality to Portuguese)
     
    Pieter Boelen likes this.
  20. Bartolomeu o Portugues

    Bartolomeu o Portugues Buccaneer Storm Modeller Storm Modder

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    2,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    web developer
    Location:
    Viana do Castelo - Portugal
    I agree :onya
    and if I understand, I want refShip.unique = true; added to the New Santiago.
     

Share This Page