Old models

[Martes]

Among the models currently featured in NH there are several large ships that remained from the old games - RN_Battleship, RN_Warship and their likes.

Their models are so low-quality they look awful near most of the other ships.

So then, why not replace those ships with models that are already in the game but rarely seen?
HMS_Centurion (even without repaint, but certainly with one - 1732 model is not that different from 1774, for instance) can take the place of the *_Warship

Bellona - of *battleship
Mordaunt - of older *battleship2
Superbe - of *battleship3
and spanish San-Felipe of *battleship4

That way the model line of at least large warships may become more unified.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

If I recall, we originally kept those stock game models because they filled gaps in the ship lineup.
But that was years ago and there have been several ships added since, so perhaps it is time to reconsider it.

@Armada and @Grey Roger, any thoughts?

 

[Armada]

Most of the original models and variants thereof are mainly kept for variety's sake; I think some were event reinstated after being removed from the mod some time ago.

I'd be happy to see older ships replaced where a contemporary model exists that could take its place, as long as we don't leave any major gaps in each of the eras' ship lineups.
I'll have to install the latest mod version to see how the ship lineup currently stands before I can comment on it. Admittedly, I've not updated my game in several months.

@Grey Roger has played a key part in arranging the ships recently, though I think he's away for this week and next week. @Hylie Pistof might be interested as well.

 

[Grey Roger]

I'll be in once or twice this week, but not at all next week.

As for ship models, I've no objection to adding new ones, but won't remove any unless there's a really good reason. In particular, I recently added the various "battleship4" models, importing the basic model from AoP (which became the French version) and creating British and Spanish textures for it because I like its appearance, so if I have any say in the matter, it's not going away again!

 

[Pieter Boelen]

if I have any say in the matter

You definitely have a say. And a big say too, I imagine.

 

[Martes]

but won't remove any unless there's a really good reason

My main problem was with "*_Warship", actually. It's very crude and essentially is a low-poly version of Centurion. I would have repainted the latter yellow (cream, red, as usual), and place it to respective nations and stretch it to the whole second part of 18th century. As I said, the Centurion that is in the game, and the next one, built in 1777 are very similar, except for slightly different keel form at the bow and more rectangular windows on the gallery, but with a repaint it may go almost unnoticed. And it's much better model, after all.

As to battleships... We'll see.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

I think the Warship models were originally named "Fearless" in the original game.
Even then, she was so underdetailed that she was not accept available.
For the mod, we added some detail and enabled her.
But fact is that model was never truly finished and is, indeed, a little bit sad...

 

[Martes]

And, to my lamentation, you encounter her in Revolutions/Napoleonic periods frequently enough to give a thought of what to do with that abomination.

 

[Captain Armstrong]

This always bugged me too! Though personally I'm just looking forward to the possibilty not to include these poor tubs in NHR.

 

[Martes]

looking forward to the possibilty not to include these poor tubs in NHR.

I thought that would be out of the question?

 

[Captain Armstrong]

Perhaps I was too diplomatic in using the word 'possibility'

 

[Hylie Pistof]

I remember that ship. It looks like it has been repainted to look not too bad. It is a 44 gun ship that is actually larger than the Centurion, which has 66 or so guns.

It also looks like I never touched her which mean she still has her 2003 rigging. Is that what makes this ship look so bad, or is there more to it?

 

[Captain Armstrong]

I don't think the rigging is particularly good, that's true. But unlike the Rossiya or stock corvette, Neither the 'battleship' or 'warship' variants are structured in a way that makes good sense from a shipbuilding perspective-which makes them unsalvagable In my eyes. Both have all sorts of weird half decks and are much too tall/large for their armaments, most elements are out of scale with another in some way. I know some people like having all the original ships in game, but I don't think from a modeling perspective they are worth fixing up-it'd be less work to replace them. Perhaps a compromise could be reached by reducing their encounter chances significantly and increasing those of other vessels in proportion?

 

[Martes]

I would agree with @Captain Armstrong - they simply don't look like real ships, especially compared to new models. It's hulls, not rigging.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

And, to my lamentation, you encounter her in Revolutions/Napoleonic periods frequently enough to give a thought of what to do with that abomination.

Do we have a full replacement?
I personally have no particular loyalty to that model.

This always bugged me too! Though personally I'm just looking forward to the possibilty not to include these poor tubs in NHR.

Indeed I don't think we want that.

Perhaps a compromise could be reached by reducing their encounter chances significantly and increasing those of other vessels in proportion?

That definitely sounds possible.

 

[Armada]

Though personally I'm just looking forward to the possibilty not to include these poor tubs in NHR.

Absolutely! Custom-built ships only.

 

[Hylie Pistof]

Ok, that was clarified. There are only 3 of them so are they needed at all?

 

[Martes]

I would say something should be in the gap of a rated 64/50/44-gunner ship, smaller than 74 (of which the game has two), yet not a frigate. And I already gave some reasoning for Centurion.

 

[Armada]

Regarding the "Warship" model, I agree that a Centurion repaint would be a suitable replacement. It looks like her textures can be easily swapped out with existing ones, too.

 

[Armada]

Bellona - of *battleship
Mordaunt - of older *battleship2
Superbe - of *battleship3
and spanish San-Felipe of *battleship4

• The Battleship model looks much earlier than Bellona, so I don't think a straight replacement would work here. Centurion is a closer match, and takes the Battleship's place in the French invasion fleet in the Tales of a Sea Hawk storyline, so really it comes down to model variety.
• Battleship2 is a bit more of an oddball design. The bow suggests a 17th century origin, hence she's limited to earlier periods than the other battleships, but the stern is just bizarre. I used to have more admiration for this model, but as I've learned more and more about ship design, that admiration has faded significantly. Mordaunt is a bit too small to replace her, though.
• Battleship3 uses a texture adapted from a past Battleship4 variant, though looking at it again, it doesn't really fit in with any period properly. Maybe with more gold decoration around the stern and a bit less black on the upper hull, she would fit in better as a late 17th/ early 18th century ship.
• Battleship4 was reinstated after being removed previously, and has some fairly nice textures. I don't think there's a suitable replacement; San Felipe is definitely too big.

Looking through these ships' encounter chances, perhaps some of them could be removed from Period 3 (1740 - 1769) where several custom models come into play that effectively take over their roles. They can remain in Period 2 (1680 - 1739) to make it distinct from its neighbouring periods. Battleship2 could then be removed from Period 2 (she's still in Period 1) so it doesn't mix in with the newer designs.