Period-accurate sail textures

[Armada]

Continuing on from a discussion started here, I've decided to make some small changes to a couple of sail textures to make them more accurate.

Initially, I slightly improved the 'Pure White' texture to make the reeflines a bit lighter and re-introduce the second texture without any reeflines. I then made a copy with a tan-coloured tint to replace the 'Weathered' texture.

Meanwhile, I also realised how to tell the game which sails can support 'emblems', using the "refShip.GeraldSails" lines in Ships_init.c.

Combining the two, and using the Constitution as a test ship, I was able to give only the squaresails the texture with reeflines, leaving the staysails and spanker without them. How does it look?

There's also a possibility to texture on the lines which prepare the sails for furling, which might look good if they're placed such that they appear to work with the actual furling animation.

Any thoughts or suggestions?

 

[Thagarr]

I really like the new sail texture, and the reef lines look much more realistic! Nice work mate!

Although the overt vertical stripes weren't all that repulsive to me, they really didn't fit that well on a square rigger.

 

[Hylie Pistof]

To my untrained yes the square sails look like the pure white ones with a darker color. This is good.
The stay sails look much much better now.

 

[Armada]

Glad you like it, mates.
There's only one potential downside to making every squaresail use the reefline texture: if you select 'emblemed' sails, then every squaresail will have an emblem, which might look very odd.
We may have to strike a balance between realism and fiction if we apply this kind of layout to all ships.

Although the overt vertical stripes weren't all that repulsive to me, they really didn't fit that well on a square rigger.

Funny thing about the vertical stripes is, when I first adjusted the Pure White texture ages ago, I covered up each line individually.
This time though, I found a much quicker way in GIMP using a filter that removes "vertical stripe artifacts" from the image. Shows what GIMP thinks of inaccurate sails!

 

[Post Captain]

Combining the two, and using the Constitution as a test ship, I was able to give only the squaresails the texture with reeflines, leaving the staysails and spanker without them. How does it look?


There's also a possibility to texture on the lines which prepare the sails for furling, which might look good if they're placed such that they appear to work with the actual furling animation.

It looks much better than it did before. However, you could add a row of reeflines to the fore-and-aft sails running along the bottom of the sail.

Spoiler

(Look at the spanker very closely for positioning in the second picture.)

The only problem with going that rout would be the fact that the higher-up stays'ls didn't have reeflines. On our Constitution model, two of the fore-and-aft sails wouldn't have reeflines, and three would. I'll leave what we do up to everyone else, since it can't be done accurately, as far as I know.
Edit- The same problem exists for sqares'ls, of course. On Constitution, the tops'ls would have four rows of reeflines, the courses (fore and mains'ls) would have two, and the t'gallants and royals would have none.


Adding the lines that assist with dousing and furling the sails would be very problematic, since sails configurations varied based on the time period, the sail's size, and the sail's type. Note the differences between the lines on Pilgrim's squares and spanker and spencer.

We could never really get them to match the furling animation- this is what sails look like when they have been doused:

I guess that will be something to work on for HOOCOTS.

At this point, you've done a great job, but I think that the game engine will limit any further improvements we try to make.

Edit: A lack of emblemed sails would be accurate for every era this game covers except early exploration.

 

[Armada]

It looks much better than it did before. However, you could add a row of reeflines to the fore-and-aft sails running along the bottom of the sail.
[...]
The only problem with going that rout would be the fact that the higher-up stays'ls didn't have reeflines.

I had considered that, but decided against it for the reasons you mentioned. Changing the second texture to include lower reeflines would mean that every stays'l would use it as well as the spanker, and the triangular ones might look particularly odd. Notice how they heavily bend the texture in the screenshot I posted.

What I can do, however, is change the t'gallants and royals to use the plain texture, if they're not meant to have reeflines. Would you say that applies to most similarly-rigged ships in general?
And do you think a second row of reeflines would look better than one (though I guess ship size should be taken into account)?

Beyond that, I think you're right in saying that the engine is the limit from here on. Getting the best out of what we've got is all we can do, and generally we're very good at it.

Adding the lines that assist with dousing and furling the sails would be very problematic, since sails configurations varied based on the time period, the sail's size, and the sail's type. Note the differences between the lines on Pilgrim's squares and spanker and spencer.

Fair enough, then. I was only suggesting it because all squares'ls furl in exactly the same way in-game, but it's only a small detail to leave out, anyway.

Edit: A lack of emblemed sails would be accurate for every era this game covers except early exploration.

True, but my only concern is that some players like to use them regardless of the era, so limiting the choice might not go down too well.
What we could do is keep earlier vessels compatible with emblems, but try to make more modern vessels more accurate to use the reefline textures, and allow emblems for all types.

 

[Post Captain]

Actually, not having reeflines on the t'gallants or royals would be great. I've only ever seen one reference to t'gallant reeflines, and not even ships of the line had them. Generally, that applied to all square-riggers, regardless of size. Taking the number of reeflines for the tops'ls and courses to two, or even three, would be a good compromise that would work for the vessels we have.
That was probably a good call with the fore-and-aft sails, I suppose.

Leaving emblems on sails would work nicely for early vessels, actually- reeflines didn't come into use until the mid 1600's, so you could even use the no-reefline texture for all the sails without emblems.

Gentlemen, I think we just gotten the best out of what we've got.

 

[Armada]

That makes things nice and simple, then! I'll add an extra row of reeflines (three might be a bit cluttered) and adjust the t'gallants and royals.
I'll post a screenshot with the results, along with the improved textures for use in both games.

The time-consuming part will be adjusting every single vessel from the later periods to use the reefline textures properly...

One more question: would sprits'ls use reeflines? That's one thing the Constitution doesn't demonstrate.

 

[Post Captain]

They would, but not like the reeflines on other sails...

Spoiler

The sprit yards actually had to be canted up or down to catch the wind, like they are in the photo. In high seas and foul weather, The row of reeflines closest to the water would be reefed. That would keep the sail out of the water. The other row was left undone, resulting in an asymmetrical shape.

In this case, I think it may be better to not use reeflines.

 

[Armada]

OK then, that's less to worry about in any case. They look quite strange at an angle like that!

Anyway, here's how Old Ironsides looks with the changes, this time with the improved 'Pure White' texture.
I have to say, I quite like this new arrangement:

The textures are available in my usual folder as 'Realistic Sails Mod.7z'. I've included one file that allows Weathered sails to use two textures, in the same way as Pure White.
Further code changes to adapt this for other ships will take some time. If you want to try out the Constitution/Battle Frigates in the meantime, add these lines to their Ships_init.c entries:

    refShip.GeraldSails.rey_a2    = 1;
    refShip.GeraldSails.rey_a3    = 1;
    refShip.GeraldSails.rey_b2    = 1;
    refShip.GeraldSails.rey_b3    = 1;
    refShip.GeraldSails.rey_b4    = 1;

 

[Post Captain]

Thanks. Do you think something similar would also work for CoAS?

 

[Pieter Boelen]

While I have not much knowledge of the historical accuracy, I definitely like the picture in that first post. Very easy on the eyes.
I reckon it's a definite improvement over the original PotBS-based weathered sail texture we have as current Build default. Good job, Armada!

There's only one potential downside to making every squaresail use the reefline texture: if you select 'emblemed' sails, then every squaresail will have an emblem, which might look very odd.

Indeed we definitely don't want that.

Edit: A lack of emblemed sails would be accurate for every era this game covers except early exploration.

That is why I set the default setting to use no emblems in the game at all and it has to be enabled on purpose.
So are you saying that in Early Explorers, there SHOULD be emblems? Maybe we should rewrite the sail selection code again, simplify it so it doesn't have as much choice, and add some period influence to it?

Thanks. Do you think something similar would also work for CoAS?

I think CoAS is fairly similar to PotC in that respect, so it probably is indeed possible.

 

[Post Captain]

That is why I set the default setting to use no emblems in the game at all and it has to be enabled on purpose.
So are you saying that in Early Explorers, there SHOULD be emblems? Maybe we should rewrite the sail selection code again, simplify it so it doesn't have as much choice, and add some period influence to it?

A few of the early vessels I've seen accurate, well-researched models have had emblems on their sails. I've heard from multiple sources that the Santa Maria sailed with a red cross on her fore and mains'ls.

Spoiler

That doesn't mean that all vessels had these emblems. In fact, I'm sure that many, if not most of them didn't.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

I always figured that the red cross emblem was pretty accurate, but anything else not so much.
You'll notice on the Worldmap Ships that is the only emblem that is used for that very reason.
Though I think I may have swapped the countries around? I put them up for the Spanish galleon...

 

[Post Captain]

There may be some other accurate emblems as well. I've seen one period painting where Spain's entire embellished coat of arms is displayed on a sprits'l. I'v seen a few that could be accurate, but that lies outside my period of expertise.

 

[Armada]

Thanks. Do you think something similar would also work for CoAS?

In theory it should be possible; I've seen snippets of code from the CoAS Ships_init file containing the 'GeraldSails' lines, so you should be able to do exactly the same thing.
You might have to ask Luke about it, to see if he can make the changes for GoF 2.

 

[Hylie Pistof]

Here are what the new sails look like in POTC on my current ship. The only changes made were to drop the files into POTC.
Oh! The instructions are not quite correct. The correct location for the texture files is POTC-->resource-->textures-->ships-->sails.

Before: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/gpalg0tpyyfcivy/iP4smu0HEa/POTC screenies/La Licorne-1.jpg

After:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/gpalg0tpyyfcivy/57OKiLUsTG/POTC screenies/La Licorne-2.jpg
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/gpalg0tpyyfcivy/rBJ5agfkDs/POTC screenies/La Licorne-3.jpg
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/gpalg0tpyyfcivy/Kpbf8Sl07h/POTC screenies/La Licorne-4.jpg

 

[Captain Armstrong]

These will be a great addition to the next build update, nice work Armada!

 

[Armada]

Oh! The instructions are not quite correct. The correct location for the texture files is POTC-->resource-->textures-->ships-->sails.

Ah yes, not the 'MODELS' folder. I wrote the instructions in a hurry.

Anyway, your screenies have reminded me that many emblem sails need to be de-striped, and a couple of code changes are needed to use the plain texture with emblems, rather than the reefline one.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

What would we want changed in the sail selection code? What default do we want and do we want any period-dependency and emblems for certain nations as well?