Low Priority [4.1] Bug or something else? itemname_hatch_11D_03 found repeatedly in jungle

[Tingyun]

In the past ten minutes, I have run into the item itemname_hatch_11D_03 3 times. It shows as a hand icon, like random items do in the jungle, and then when I hit spacebar to pick the item up, it says "you have found an itemname_hatch_11D_03" . In the scene, it looks like some kind of wooden board.

I have attached a saved game where I stumbled upon the third one in the outskits. The other two were found at the barbados canyon.

Is something perhaps wrong with my saved game? I have never seen these items before, and now they are eveerywhere. Or is it a bug, and they somehow made it into the random item table and my saved game is ok? I'm a bit worried actually, because I just had to go back to an earlier saved game because one corrupted, and I am worried there might be something wrong.

Thanks for any insight!

 

[Levis]

@Jack Rackham any idea why these hatches appear in the jungle?

@Tingyun what where you doing before?

 

[Tingyun]

Levis, when I got a couple corrupt saved games? I was exploring the dungeon in the back of the maltese abbey (the one modeled off of port royal dungeon). In that dungeon, I killed the 20 or so monks, and the game started lagging after they were all dead, and then when I went to the main menu and started to save windows said the exe file was terminated, and then upon restarting it said the game I had tried to save was a "bad save". So I went back to the save before that, went back into the same dungeon, killed them again and the same lagging began, so I just exited the dungeon before pressing any menu button, and after exiting it saved fine, so I figured that was ok to keep playing, and decided to skip that dungeon.

I just loaded a save before all that happened, went to the same places in the jungle, and that weird item is there in the earlier save as well, so it at least doesn't seem related after all.

 

[Jack Rackham]

Sounds like one of my items so I'll add it to my to-do-list.

 

[Levis]

It seems to be this one:

 n = InitBuildingItemJRH(n,    "hatch11D_O3",            "hatch11D_O3");        //dito brighter, Pym's, hotel

used in "Pym_study" and "Cartagena_hotel_private".

I have no idea how this would end up in the jungle ..

 

[Tingyun]

the one in the outskirts in the save was in a spot for random items (where you find little bags of gold or potions every few days). Maybe it made it on to the random item list somehow?

The ones in the canyon probably were too, but can't be sure, it was my first time in the barbados canyon.

I really hope it isn't something messed up with my save.

EDIT: Looks similar to this bug report from a year ago Cannot Confirm - BuildingSet Structures Appearing as Random Items | PiratesAhoy!

He mentions he was a castaway too when the bug occurred, not sure if it could have something to do with spending lots of time hunting on land.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

There is another Bug Tracker item by @ANSEL where he also reported very inappropriate items showing up at random.
This was months ago and he never managed to replicate it anymore since.
Sounds like this is the same bug though. Apparently quite rare until it suddenly becomes common. Very strange!

I wonder... If you press F11 to reinitialize, does the problem stop again?

 

[Tingyun]

Pieter,

Yes, Ansel's unconfirmed bug report is the one I linked in my edit above. I am going to reinitialize and see if it continues, though apparently Ansel said in that thread that he did reinitialize frequently but still hit the bug. I'll see if I have better luck.

However, I thought about this more, and I wonder if the problem isn't with Jack Rackham's items at all, but instead something gets glitched in the function for random items in general. Here are some things to consider:

I recently came across a 4 barrel grapeshot pistol on the ground that I picked up. This obviously should not have shown up as a random item (given I'm in golden age, and it is first supposed to exist in Napoleanic), but it was in a deep room in the Maltese crypt, so I figured it was an intentionally placed reward of some kind. But now I wonder if it could have been a random item improperly showing up as well.

Also, right before hitting the weird items I found a valuable piece of jewelry that sells for around 10,000 as a random item in Bridgetown. Seemed excessive, but I figured maybe it was just a small chance.

Adding this together, I wonder if the reason Ansel and I complained of Jack Rackham's items is because they are obviously wrong, but the whole time a lot of other improper items could have been showing up and escaped attention?

Just speculating, have no idea how any of this works.

 

[Tingyun]

@Pieter Boelen

I used the two itemname_hatch_11D_03 items present in the barbados canyon in the posted saved game for testing.

Test 1: left 1 alone, picked up the other one, reinitilized, and then let several months go by at sea.

Result 1: the one that I had picked up was replaced with a new random item, a clay jar. The one that I had left alone was still there, itemname_hatch_11D_03.

Test 2: Picked both of them up, let several months go by.

Result 2: One was replaced by a small mosaic, the other by an antidote potion.


So they are definitely appearing as random items, but as my previous post states, not sure if the bug is specific to Jack Rackham's items, or whether that 10k jewelry or 4 barrel grapeshot were errors as well, and something more general got messed up.

Also can't say if reinitilizing fixed it or not, but at least in this test it didn't come back the first 3 times random items were rolled.

I have two questions to guide my further testing as I watch out for this in normal play:

1) is it safe for my game to pick up these itemname_hatch_11D_03 items, to clear the current ones out, or will that potentially mess up my game? They don't seem to appear in inventory if I pick them up.

2) are randomly placed items generated when you enter an island the first time, or are they generated for the entire world when you first start playing and don't change unless picked up?

Number 2 is important for me to know, so that I can know whether finding more itemname_hatch_11D_03 items after initilizing in a new location could still have been the bug from them being created before, or is evidence the problem persists.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Random items are regenerated every few days upon entering the location where they're found.

 

[Tingyun]

Hi Pieter,

I understand they get regenerated every few days, but they don't seem to regenerate currently generated items unless the current object has been picked up by the player (at least that is how it behaved in my above tests). So since not picking up the weird items will lead to them persisting for months rather than being regenerated, my two questions are getting at how to interpret future instances of encountering them after reinitilization, and whether that means the glitch continues or they are just left over from before.

I'm especially interested in question 1, because if it is safe to pick up the current weird items then I can clear them out manually and watch those same random spawn points in the future as they regenerate.

 

[Jack Rackham]

"hatch_11D_03" doesn't exist in the game. Maybe it was "hatch11D_O" but that one
should only be available in WoodesRogers, GoldBug or Bartolomeu. Which storyline were
you playing?

 

[Tingyun]

Hi Jack Rackham,

Freeplay, but it is itemname_hatch_11D_03 (or maybe O3, I can't tell the difference well )

I just loaded up the saved game I posted in the first post of this thread, and double checked the name. If you load the saved game yourself, you are standing right in front of it, you can confirm.

So, even weirder of a bug then?

 

[ANSEL]

Some weird stuff is going on after installing the last ZIP. I dont
know if it is related to the problem on this page, but it reminds me of the unconfirmed bug
I found months ago.
Log: ItemLogic: Loaded model ammo\\BuildingItemsJRH\suspension_bridge

 

[Jack Rackham]

Hmm yes that's mine too. But it shouldn't be in the game yet. And certainly not there.
To me these bugs sounds like randitems suddenly can choose from ANY buildingitems.
But as I said earlier "my" items are only availabe in my quests + Bartolomeu's. And not
as random randitems but as additions to locations.

 

[Jack Rackham]

No, I was not quite right there.
"hatch11D_O3" exists and is like the "suspension_bridge" not only available in certain quests.
They are building items though and shouldn't appear as random randitems.
Maybe this situation with buildingitems for common use is new and has to be stopped from
being used as randitems.

 

[Tingyun]

Hi Jack Rackham,

Aside from the itemname_hatch_11D_03 (or O3), see my earlier post about previously finding a 4 barrel grapeshot pistol (in golden age of piracy, long before napoleanic, in the crypt), and a 10k piece of jewelry around town. So I also suspect it might be just picking from any item.

But the odd thing is, why did I get 3 of the itemname_hatch_11D_03 (or O3) all at once? Seems a large coincidence.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Sounds like something broke for sure.
This didn't really happen even two weeks ago, did it?

If you play with only the EXE I uploaded last, can this still occur?
If not, then it must be something with the file @Levis posted, which means I need to pay extra attention to that when installing it to my own game next week or so.

 

[Tingyun]

@Pieter Boelen

You are right--it was the update. Saved games attached.

I ran the following test:

Loaded up a save from Aug 20th, before the update, and either reinitilized to load the new updated files, or did not reinitilize, before entering the scene with the strange item.

If reinitilized, then the random item is itemname_hatch_11D_O3

If I did not reinitilize, then the random item is a potion.

So something in the update caused this it seems. One thing, I checked multiple instances of the weird item, and before reinitilizing, they were different items (not all potions). So for some reason it turned different items into the same weird item. So it seems to be about the random item location, not the item itself.

2nd Round of Tests: showed that random items other than this itemname_hatch_11D_03 DO get replaced if you leave them alone for several days, just like Pieter said. But this one stays there, even for months, until you pick it up, and only then starts getting replaced by random items.

So not a bug with the random items so much as causing a one time spawn of these things replacing and blocking random items until picked up.

3rd Round of Tests: Took my recent saved game, long after the bug had appeared, confirmed the weird item was there, put the saved game in a backup directory of the July 28th not updated release, loaded it up, reinitilized, and went back to the item.

It had transformed back to a purse of 100 gold coins!

SUMMARY: updating and reinitilizing caused it, and reverting to July 28th version and reinitilizing fixes it. Reinitilizing is needed, so the bug is in some file that needs to be reinitilized. The bug isn't the improper placement of random items at all, instead it replaces all sorts of random items (money, potions) with a very specific weird item, that persists until picked up, rather than getting replaced every couple of days like normal items, and those items get transformed back when the game is reverted and reinitilized. The bug is tied to specific random item spawn points it seems, because going from a prior pre update save and reinitilizing, those same places always have their items transformed.

Any suspicion as to which file caused it?

Also, since no incompatibility in updating, there probably isn't incompatibility in reverting the files involved to the earlier version and continuing a saved game?

 

[Pieter Boelen]

The files in the PROGRAM\ITEMS folder are then most likely to be the cause of this.
I'll be sure to pay proper attention to those when merging.

In the meantime, try the latest update but maintaining the ITEMS folder from the previous one.
If my suspicion is correct, things should be OK then.