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Am I allowed to modify work made by a previous modder? Not errors, but narrative style?

Fluen

Freebooter
Nathan Kell made the quest texts for The Saga of the Blaques. And I think, he went too far with the strong language about Orable Caron. I would like to modify that to a more modest version.

Besides, when those quest texts were written, female main characters had not been implemented. That makes the quest texts about being brushed off by Rachel Blaque seem a bit strange, when the player's character can now be a woman. And why would Rachel Blaque be an adopted sister to Marc Blaque?

In short, I'd like to change several things, Nathan Kell chose to write. Not because, they are erratic, but because I find the narrative style wrong. But that might be my personal opinion and not one shared by others.

Am I even allowed to try something like that? Or should I respect Nathan Kell's efforts?
 
Let's respect everyone's personal work. Changing the scripts or something that will ultimately change the storyline is a big NO unless of course seen as inappropriate by the staff and or admins. Sometimes the authors/modders have their own way or signatures of their work making it unique or very identifiable to others as to who made it. So things like what you are noticing right now might be intentional but don't quote me on that.

With that, you can pretty much modify whatever you want. But if you're trying to change someone's work even just a little bit, you might want to get permission from the author him/herself. When you get it, make your changes, have it approved by the author again, and then have it approved by the staff or admins (most likely @Grey Roger lol)

Of course, if you make a change to make someone's work better e.g. bug fixing, better animation, better models and the like those are very much welcomed without question.
 
Thank you for clarifying. I'll stay away from making changes to the quest texts, unless I find actual errors and missing details.
 
The problem with opening that door is that anyone can walk through! Someone else might not like the change of style and may want to modify it again. Or a traditionalist might decide to prefer the original version and put it back.

Additional dialog and questbook text for female player characters is another matter. A lot of work along those lines has already been done, especially in "Tales of a Sea Hawk". If you want to make up some alternative lines for female player characters and add them to the ends of files, I should be able to modify the dialog or quest code to pick the appropriate lines depending on the player character's gender.
 
The problem with opening that door is that anyone can walk through! Someone else might not like the change of style and may want to modify it again. Or a traditionalist might decide to prefer the original version and put it back.
You are right.

I'll see, if I can come up with some lines for a female character - unless we let them be and decide, that bisexuality is a thing in the Caribbean in the sixteenth to the eighteenth hundres, and the player's character is bisexual (or open to all the fun available).

When I once tried out some of the not so noble choices in this quest, I encouraged Orable Caron to continue his pursuit of Rachel Blaque. But only when I later talked to Marc, I found out (from what my own character said), that this had killed Rachel. That piece of information is missing from the quest texts, and I want to add that too.
 
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Well, someone once must have made the very first bit of Devlin Opera and I changed and adapted that to my liking as well. I don't know either, why Rachel is supposed to be adopted.
 
Am I even allowed to try something like that? Or should I respect Nathan Kell's efforts?
You are here and therefore you are a Pirate.
How much permission does a pirate need?

Of course you are allowed to mod whatever you like.
You are allowed to share any of your work too.

Whether your changes end up in the main "New Horizons" mod is a different story.
That choice is up to the person doing the compiling; which is @Grey Roger nowadays.

Asking permission of the original modder is always a courteous thing to do though.
Though many modders likely would no longer respond as they've moved on to different things in their lives.

Well, someone once must have made the very first bit of Devlin Opera and I changed and adapted that to my liking as well.
@Short Jack Gold made the start.
Same person who started with the Jack Sparrow and Hornblower storylines too.
Sparrow was then continued by @Bartolomeu o Portugues; and now @Sebrian too.
And Hornblower has received extra updated by @Grey Roger.

unless we let them be and decide, that bisexuality is a thing in the Caribbean in the sixteenth to the eighteenth hundres
Wouldn't even be so crazy.
It was already a thing back in Ancient Greek times.
 
You are right.

I'll see, if I can come up with some lines for a female character - unless we let them be and decide, that bisexuality is a thing in the Caribbean in the sixteenth to the eighteenth hundres, and the player's character is bisexual (or open to all the fun available).
If bisexuality is included in the game, it should not inextricably be linked to being female. If you want to add extra lines for female characters, go ahead. You might also like a look at this thread:
Improving gameplay for female player characters
Making gameplay a bit more distinctive for female player characters is no bad thing!

When I once tried out some of the not so noble choices in this quest, I encouraged Orable Caron to continue his pursuit of Rachel Blaque. But only when I later talked to Marc, I found out (from what my own character said), that this had killed Rachel. That piece of information is missing from the quest texts, and I want to add that too.
Also perhaps consider how the player learns that Rachel is dead. You leave St. Pierre having told 'Orrible Orable to put her in her place, and the questbook says "... he'll show Rachel who's boss". Then you arrive at Port Royale and somehow know that he killed her.

Well, someone once must have made the very first bit of Devlin Opera and I changed and adapted that to my liking as well. I don't know either, why Rachel is supposed to be adopted.
@Short Jack Gold made the start.
Did other modders chip in as well? Or did @Short Jack Gold include them himself, as @BathtubPirate put my alter ego into Bonnie's party in San Pedro? (Incidentally, I fully approve of the character's dialog. If I were at the party, it would probably be for exactly the same reason. :cheers)

In any case, as far as I could tell from the one time I played it long ago before the current update, it seemed to be an attempt to import what passed for a storyline in the stock AoP. It lay abandoned and unfinished for ages, and anyone who worked on it has probably long since left. So it's fair game for a rewrite.

As for why Rachel is adopted - the player doesn't need to know every intimate detail of the family's lives. ;) At a guess, Milon adopted Rachel because her own family was too poor to look after her, or perhaps her parents died while she was still very young. We can assume the adoption happened before Marc went missing because Marc and Rachel know each other as brother and sister.
 
Did other modders chip in as well? Or did @Short Jack Gold include them himself, as @BathtubPirate put my alter ego into Bonnie's party in San Pedro?
Originally SJG added a bunch of Modder avatars into both the Devlin and Sparrow storylines.

But I think Bartholomeu was even earlier with adding a Modder:
Specifically when he made Turks Help featuring...
Me.

Let it be very clear that *I* never added myself to the game.

Unless you count Vanderdecken.
That was virtually completely my own creation.
Still like the guy. :cheeky
 
If bisexuality is included in the game, it should not inextricably be linked to being female..
It isn't. When the main character (female) asks Simon Hanpool about the tablets, she's told about the lad (Nathaniel), who received a proposition from one of the dockworkers. Only Nathaniel wasn't interested and "he put him in his place".

Also perhaps consider how the player learns that Rachel is dead. You leave St. Pierre having told 'Orrible Orable to put her in her place, and the questbook says "... he'll show Rachel who's boss". Then you arrive at Port Royale and somehow know that he killed her.
Sorry, but that didn't make sense to me. So one shows one is boss by killing the opponent? Works fine for a pirate, but less for a person in love. o_O
 
Sorry, but that didn't make sense to me. So one shows one is boss by killing the opponent? Works fine for a pirate, but less for a person in love. o_O
That's sort of my point. You're encouraging Orable to act tougher and not take "no" for an answer, you're not expecting him to kill Rachel. Presumably he then goes too far and is more vicious than you'd expected. Somehow you have to find out what really happened before you can tell Marc. I can probably do the coding, just give me some ideas to work with...
 
That's sort of my point. You're encouraging Orable to act tougher and not take "no" for an answer, you're not expecting him to kill Rachel. Presumably he then goes too far and is more vicious than you'd expected. Somehow you have to find out what really happened before you can tell Marc. I can probably do the coding, just give me some ideas to work with...


Perhaps it's unclear whether it was an accident or intentional. He took her for a walk and she fell (or was pushed and slipped during another argument) either on the rickety bridge or off the adjacent cliff you added. Dialogue with Marc would need to be Orable was responsible (even if only because without him she wouldn't have been there) rather than her killer. Orable claims an accident but the locals have their own views (based on their personal views of Orable).. Perhaps Orable and the tavern keeper could have dialogue, one for each side of the thing, which if you have discovered either gives the dead dialogue for Marc otherwise left to be discovered later?

Feel free to ignore this completely if you don't like it, don't want to draw attention to the added location(s) or @Fluen has a contribution.

Incidentally I am thinking of giving Marc a role in redeeming Baldewyn's store for a strand where it is not under duress of colony capture - he has knowledge of the goings on but then of course disappeared. So when he is "found" he can give testimony against Arnaud to the Governor (under pressure/suggestion from pchar) which helps replace Baldewyn.

I also wonder if Sabine wanting to sail is linked to a crush on Marc really (He's the Captain in her dream) who has vanished although it remains unspoken (is she hoping to run into him) but that is another reason she doesn't want to be married off.
 
Perhaps it's unclear whether it was an accident or intentional. He took her for a walk and she fell (or was pushed and slipped during another argument) either on the rickety bridge or off the adjacent cliff you added. Dialogue with Marc would need to be Orable was responsible (even if only because without him she wouldn't have been there) rather than her killer. Orable claims an accident but the locals have their own views (based on their personal views of Orable).. Perhaps Orable and the tavern keeper could have dialogue, one for each side of the thing, which if you have discovered either gives the dead dialogue for Marc otherwise left to be discovered later?
Isn't that a bit out of character for Rachel? We know that Orable fancies her but she wants nothing to do with him; he's already been violent and you've seen the bruise; and she won't even go to the beach to see Milon unless you threaten Orable. So she's certainly not going for a walk with him to the far side of Martinique! The idea of a two-stage investigation makes sense, though. You could ask Orable how he's getting on with Rachel, he says she died in an accident, then you talk to someone else who tells you it wasn't an accident. After that, you might want to kill Orable. Partly to avenge Rachel, partly to atone for your role in her death, and partly because you don't want him on the beach when Marc arrives in case he tells Marc who put him up to it...

I haven't added a cliff (apart from the bit in the bridge location) but that gives me an idea...

Incidentally I am thinking of giving Marc a role in redeeming Baldewyn's store for a strand where it is not under duress of colony capture - he has knowledge of the goings on but then of course disappeared. So when he is "found" he can give testimony against Arnaud to the Governor (under pressure/suggestion from pchar) which helps replace Baldewyn.
The snag there is timing. Marc disappeared about five years ago, so if he knows about the store takeover then that must also have happened at least five years ago. Loansharks don't give you anything like five years to pay back a debt, so why would Arnaud wait that long before chasing Baldewyn for his loaned money? On the other hand, if you don't hire Marc then he goes to the store, presumably for a job, where he could uncover something incriminating. If you do hire him, you could perhaps ask him to detach from the ship, work for Arnaud for a while, and do a bit of snooping.

I also wonder if Sabine wanting to sail is linked to a crush on Marc really (He's the Captain in her dream) who has vanished although it remains unspoken (is she hoping to run into him) but that is another reason she doesn't want to be married off.
There's no need to tie all the sidequests on Martinique together. ;) Besides, this won't work if you complete the Blacque family quest before starting Baldewyn/Sabine and choose not to hire Marc; Sabine won't need to go to sea to look for him if he's standing there in front of her! The existing motive works well - Sabine wants to get away from her father and from being forced to marry his choice of husband, and sailing away is a good way to do it.

As for the cliff. The stock game name for both island and town, still used for coding, is "Falaise de Fleur", which literally translates as "Flower Cliff". And the old Carib name for the island, Madinina, translates as "Land of Flowers". At present I've set the bridge to lead to a simple jungle path which leads to another piece of jungle with a T-shaped path - if you're doing the "Crystal Skull" quest, this is where the Carib warrior finds the skull. One branch of the T leads back the way you came. The other two currently lead to each end of another simple jungle path location just to have them go somewhere. I now plan to replace that with a cliff location based on "Muelle_passage", using the flowery grass texture, and named "Falaise de Fleur" - not a place-holder variable like the town and island, but the unmodified name.
 
Actually, I just intended to add to the quest text about make Caron act more tough something along the lines: "later I learned that Rachel had resisted his advances so violently, that she'd died from her injuries".
If Caron doesn't take no for an answer, thing might very well end in violence. And perhaps she fell and hit her head or broke her neck. Or Caron in fear, she might call for help, accidentally strangled her.
 
Is sweet Rachel getting killed?
Oh dear.
I'm so sorry... :(
Only if you're evil and encourage Orable to get tough with her. If you instead choose to threaten him, you can then tell Rachel that he won't bother her any more, at which point she moves to the port area to keep an eye on Milon.
I didn't get the idea to kill Rachel! :sick That'll be either Alkella or Nathan Kell. Don't shoot the messenger here! :pirate41:
Indeed. We're not encouraging the player to get her killed, just making sure the player knows the consequences of saying the wrong thing to Orable before reporting it to Marc.
 
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