• New Horizons on Maelstrom
    Maelstrom New Horizons


    Visit our website www.piratehorizons.com to quickly find download links for the newest versions of our New Horizons mods Beyond New Horizons and Maelstrom New Horizons!

Build 13 Beta

mrmistophelees

mrmistophelees

Landlubber
Yoho!

After playing the latest build for awhile, I started to become bored because there were no more real challenges in random combat anymore. I'm playing on the third level of difficulty... Adventurer I think it's called. Let me lay out my experiences:

1. I had just met Rabel at Oxbay and was bringing his ship back to Redmond on the main quest. Twice I attempted to sink or capture the French 100 gun ship of the line that was blocking the bay with Rabel's Frigate. Both times, in the middle of battle, the game CTD. So I gave up and on the third attempt just ran like I was supposed to. As soon as I got to Redmond, I put into port and completed the mission. Upon leaving port however, I noticed that same French 100 gun line ship (with the same name) and it's escort frigate fighting the Fort at Redmond. I saw my opportunity to capture it, and capture it I did (with my Light Frigate). Now I have that ship of the line, and what a broadside it commands! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/piratesing.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":shock" border="0" alt="piratesing.gif" />

But why did it appear in Redmond bay after the mission? Does the game have it follow me all the way to Redmond?

2. I think that I am able to tweak this in the buildsetting.h file, but one thing that I have become disappointed in is how quickly enemy ships lose morale and surrender. I have only just achieved "well-known pirate" status, but sea battles are really routine now... I fire several broadsides into them (it doesn't matter if they are chain, grape, or round shot) and they give up. I don't think morale should be lost so quickly, but even if it does, I don't think the ship should give up so quickly. A ship should have lost almost all of it's men, or be almost sinking to actually give up.... considering that the crew face imprisonment or death if they are captured... right?
(By the way, I've ONLY been fighting pirates)

Using these tactics I have amassed over 3 million in gold, have at least 25 officers of very high level, and I've just achieved level 22 myself. And I just sail around with my Light Frigate as Flag ship, and my 100 gun Ship of the Line as support. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sailr.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":sail" border="0" alt="sailr.gif" />
Some suggestions:
a. Ships shouldn't give up so easily. I almost never board an active ship because they give up so quickly.
b. It seems way too easy to capture large ships. I easily capture a light frigate with a little war schooner... and the reason is because the light frigate SURRENDERED to me! Unbelievable... There should definitely be something that significantly slows the morale decay in a large vessal against a small one.


On a seperate issue, since I've amassed so much wealth, I've been trying to find a way to use it. I decided at the same time to mess around with the building set. I've modified the appropriate files so that building a house costs 250 planks and 150,000 in coin, and the prices only go up from there. I have two issues that I've run into however:
a. When determining how many planks the player has, it only looks at the flag ship. I could have thousands of planks on another ship, but it doesn't matter.
b. I've only built a couple of the building so far, but the house seems to have a problem with the texture. The outside looks fine, but the inside has this really weird black and white speckled texture that moves around when the player moves. It's quite strange.
<img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/type_1.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":nk" border="0" alt="type_1.gif" />

Edit: Ah, one more thing. One of the shores on Cuba isn't working right. I "sail to" it and get the moor icon, but when I try to moor there, nothing happens, I just stay on the ship. I can continue sailing however.
 
I'd advise you to change SURRENDER_MULT in BuildSettings.h, but that's never used anywhere. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" /> It used to be used in boardings, but I've removed it.

I've noticed ships often surrender too easily. I'll have a look at why, and maybe use SURRENDER_MULT there instead.

Oh, and only "well-known pirate"? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" /> Here's a challenge: try to get to Scourge of the Seven Seas. I've got one character up to Scourge of the Archipelago, and have seen Scourge of the Caribbean. Hint: Divide the Loot helps a lot.

Hook
 
Figured it out. There's a variable in InternalSettings.h called SURR_GLOBAL_SCL which is *supposed* to scale the surrender chance. This is set to 0.3 in the current game, but not used to scale surrender.

To change the surrender chance, look for the following code in PROGRAM/SEA_AI/AIShip.c

<!--c1--><div class='codetop'>CODE</div><div class='codemain'><!--ec1-->}
Trace("SURR: for char " + rCharacter.id + " of ship " + rCharacter.ship.name + " surrender chance is " + round(surch*100.0)+"%");
<!--c2--></div><!--ec2-->

Hint: search for "SURR: for char"

... and add a new line as follows:

<!--c1--><div class='codetop'>CODE</div><div class='codemain'><!--ec1-->}
surch *= SURR_GLOBAL_SCL;
Trace("SURR: for char " + rCharacter.id + " of ship " + rCharacter.ship.name + " surrender chance is " + round(surch*100.0)+"%");
<!--c2--></div><!--ec2-->

You can set the SURR_GLOBAL_SCL variable to zero to have ships never surrender if you wish. This already works in the game. But setting it to some low value will keep ships from surrendering so much. Even 0.3 might be too high, so experiment and let us know at what value it feels right for you.

Hook
 
<!--quoteo(post=162458:date=Sep 19 2006, 04:52 PM:name=Hook)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Hook @ Sep 19 2006, 04:52 PM) [snapback]162458[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Oh, and only "well-known pirate"? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" /> Here's a challenge: try to get to Scourge of the Seven Seas. I've got one character up to Scourge of the Archipelago, and have seen Scourge of the Caribbean. Hint: Divide the Loot helps a lot.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

<img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/razz.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":razz" border="0" alt="razz.gif" />
Ya ya... He's still quite a new character though... I haven't had time to up his rating. Besides, the point of me saying that I had gotten that rating is that the ships shouldn't have been so timid in the face of "only a well-known pirate"
<img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/bow.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":bow" border="0" alt="bow.gif" />

Thanks for the tip on what to change! I have a question about that code though... is it variable? I don't want every ship to fight to the last breadth... I would like some variation. Possible?
 
It changes all ship surrenders when you're on deck. Boarding surenders are handled separately.

I changed mine to 0.3 and didn't see any difference. So I changed it to 0.1 and the difference was noticable. The two ships I fought lasted maybe twice as long as they normally would have.

It's hard to predict exactly what the effect will be with any given number. For example, a ship might have a maximum 10% chance of surrendering after the mods. How many times do you have to roll a d10 to get a zero? It may come up quickly, it may take a very long time.

I'm going to look at the morale changes as well, as enemy ships seem to lose morale quickly. This is good for quick gameplay, but some people might want more of a challenge. Whatever I come up with will have a toggle on it, or at least a scaling variable so you can make it act however you want.

Hook
 
0.1 always did well for me. Battles would last a long time... however SOME ships would surrender off real quick. Like when I found a battle going on between merchants and warships (merchants surrendering very quickly it seems).

I didnt care about when/if the captain surrenders during a boarding raid. So I never noticed that the other setting never worked. Both those settings should really show up in the BS.h file... and since you'e going to be fixing them, might as well name them something user-friendly. Those NK names for things were fairly confusing to people.
 
<!--quoteo(post=162526:date=Sep 20 2006, 09:23 AM:name=IncredibleHat)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(IncredibleHat @ Sep 20 2006, 09:23 AM) [snapback]162526[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
0.1 always did well for me. Battles would last a long time... however SOME ships would surrender off real quick. Like when I found a battle going on between merchants and warships (merchants surrendering very quickly it seems).
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

That's odd, because without that one line of code added, SURR_GLOBAL_SCL does nothing more than check to see if it should check for surrender at all. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" /> Anything above zero would all give the same result no matter what the value of SURR_GLOBAL_SCL was.

Merchant ships surrender quicker than other ships anyway.

Hook
 
I have a couple of questions about the beta.

Are we sure the boarding decks/cabins are working right? For example, I boarded a sloop from a merchantman and got the big deck. On the smae boarding we wound up in the large cabin.


Pieter,

I know blade damage is working because I here enemies blades break and see them fighting without blades, but niether my or my officers have experienced <b>any</b> blade deterioration after fighting many boardings over three and a half months of game time. Is this right? Is there a setting somewhere? Should I just accept my good fortune and shut up?
 
<!--quoteo(post=162587:date=Sep 20 2006, 05:08 PM:name=Jason)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jason @ Sep 20 2006, 05:08 PM) [snapback]162587[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Are we sure the boarding decks/cabins are working right? For example, I boarded a sloop from a merchantman and got the big deck. On the smae boarding we wound up in the large cabin.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If you got the big cabin when taking on a sloop, it's likely that he boarded you instead. This happens all the time to me.

Now, if it wasn't the normal merchantman cabin, we may have another issue.

Hook
 
hmm... About the boarding deck. I am ALWAYS the one to initiate boarding (I think), usually because the enemy has surrendered and lies hove-to. But when I board her, I almost always get the biggest deck and maybe very rarely get the smallest deck. I go around in a light frigate with a 100 gun Line ship in tow. I don't know if that matters or not.
So I have noticed that the boarding backdrop may be a bit weird too. I don't think I should always be getting the biggest deck when I board a surrendered ship.
 
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Now, if it wasn't the normal merchantman cabin, we may have another issue<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Well I think it was frigate and up cabin. Lot's of space like eight of my guys fighting. I thought the merchantman cabin was the middle sized one you get on Corvetts, no?
 
<!--quoteo(post=162587:date=Sep 21 2006, 12:08 AM:name=Jason)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jason @ Sep 21 2006, 12:08 AM) [snapback]162587[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
I know blade damage is working because I here enemies blades break and see them fighting without blades, but niether my or my officers have experienced <b>any</b> blade deterioration after fighting many boardings over three and a half months of game time. Is this right? Is there a setting somewhere? Should I just accept my good fortune and shut up?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hmm. That's odd. Please press the F12 key and tell me what appears on the screen. It should be something like:
<i>Number of times enemy hit PChar while PChar blocking: 920
Number of times PChar hit enemy while enemy blocking: 1025</i>

These values will help me in figuring out how long it would take for your blade to break. At the moment it takes at least 1000 hits during blocking (minus any penalties) before your blade has any chance of breaking. That might be too much. This does not apply to enemies, because they start with a random number of times they blocked using their blade, so they might already be above the minimum for the blade to break.

Edit:
Something you could also do: Set BLADEDAMAGE_BASE and BLADEDAMAGE_RAND to some very low values in BuildSettings.h (set both to 10, for example) and see if your blades do break every now and then using those values. With those values, your blade should break after about 15 times blocking or being blocked, so basically your blade should decrease in quality all the time. If it doesn't, something is wrong.
 
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That's odd, because without that one line of code added, SURR_GLOBAL_SCL does nothing more than check to see if it should check for surrender at all. biggrin.gif Anything above zero would all give the same result no matter what the value of SURR_GLOBAL_SCL was.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ah... must be doing what it's doing because I also adjusted SURR_MRL_SCL_MAX/MIN ... because those are different numbers than whats default in my file. Oops.
 
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->press the F12 key and tell me what appears on the screen. It should be something like:
Number of times enemy hit PChar while PChar blocking: 920
Number of times PChar hit enemy while enemy blocking: 1025<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


Pieter,

Those values are 401 and 90.
 
Do you guys hear it when you draw your sword?
I don't.

Another thing I notice is you now have to sell goods off of ships first before you sell the ship at shipyard.
That is if you want to get the greatest profit.
 
<!--quoteo(post=162716:date=Sep 21 2006, 05:47 PM:name=Jason)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jason @ Sep 21 2006, 05:47 PM) [snapback]162716[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Those values are 401 and 90.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Those are the values after three months of gametime? How many times do you reckon your blade should decrease in quality during that time?

This means that you have had a total of 491 times that you were hit during blocking or have hit an enemy during blocking. If this amount is greater than BLADEDAMAGE_BASE, then there is a chance of your blade decreasing in quality. If this amount is greater than BLADEDAMAGE_BASE + BLADEDAMAGE_RAND, then your blade will have decreased in quality.

So if you would set BLADEDAMAGE_BASE and BLADEDAMAGE_RAND both to 100, then your blade would have decreased in quality now between 2,5 and 5 times. This means that with these values, your blade might break within 3 months of gametime. Does that sound reasonable to you? These values would not be realistic, but that doesn't matter if it works in the game. The bladedamage should not occur too often, but also not too infrequent. With the current values, it migth indeed take forever for your own blade to break, because the current values are over the 10000! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/piratesing.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":shock" border="0" alt="piratesing.gif" />

<!--quoteo(post=162731:date=Sep 21 2006, 06:43 PM:name=Petros)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Petros @ Sep 21 2006, 06:43 PM) [snapback]162731[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Do you guys hear it when you draw your sword?
I don't.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Last time I checked, I did hear it.

<!--quoteo(post=162731:date=Sep 21 2006, 06:43 PM:name=Petros)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Petros @ Sep 21 2006, 06:43 PM) [snapback]162731[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Another thing I notice is you now have to sell goods off of ships first before you sell the ship at shipyard.
That is if you want to get the greatest profit.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Is that so? That didn't use to be so. Odd. Maybe IncredibleHat forgot to implement the automatic selling of the cargo onboard the ship to his shipyard interface rewrite? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />
 
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So if you would set BLADEDAMAGE_BASE and BLADEDAMAGE_RAND both to 100, then your blade would have decreased in quality now between 2,5 and 5 times. This means that with these values, your blade might break within 3 months of gametime. Does that sound reasonable to you? These values would not be realistic, but that doesn't matter if it works in the game. The bladedamage should not occur too often, but also not too infrequent. With the current values, it migth indeed take forever for your own blade to break, because the current values are over the 10000! <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->



All right, I will try it a 100.

Also see my reply above to Petros on the shipyard.
 
<!--quoteo(post=162743:date=Sep 21 2006, 07:13 PM:name=Jason)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jason @ Sep 21 2006, 07:13 PM) [snapback]162743[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
All right, I will try it a 100.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You can try setting both to 1. Then your blade should decrease in quality after EVERY SINGLE BLOCK. That way, you can check if the code works at all. If you can confirm that the code works, try setting it to 100 and see if that seems well-balanced to you.


<!--quoteo(post=162743:date=Sep 21 2006, 07:13 PM:name=Jason)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jason @ Sep 21 2006, 07:13 PM) [snapback]162743[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Also see my reply above to Petros on the shipyard.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What do you mean? I saw the reply above Petros' one already. I replied to it, didn't I? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />
 
<!--quoteo(post=162740:date=Sep 21 2006, 01:01 PM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Sep 21 2006, 01:01 PM) [snapback]162740[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
...Is that so? That didn't use to be so. Odd. Maybe IncredibleHat forgot to implement the automatic selling of the cargo onboard the ship to his shipyard interface rewrite? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

I believe cargo on board is sold. You get more for the ship if it has cargo, than if it is empty.

However, you seem to get twice as much for the cargo if you sell it to the merchant first.



Back to sounds, or their absence, locked doors don't knock either.
What files call for the Sabre_out.wav file?
 
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What do you mean? I saw the reply above Petros' one already. I replied to it, didn't I?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


Yes you did, Sorry!

<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I believe cargo on board is sold. You get more for the ship if it has cargo, than if it is empty.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Ahh! I didn't check that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top