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Do Cutters have 1 or 2 masts ?

Talisman

Talisman

Smuggler
Storm Modder
I must admit to knowing nothing about sailing ships.

I have been sailing the British designed cutter shown below for quite a while in PotC, I felt something was wrong, but did not realise till I had a closer look.

So is it just the rigging that is wrong or is there a mast ( foremast? ) missing. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/dunno.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":shrug" border="0" alt="dunno.gif" />

no error log has been generated, system and compile are attached
 
The cutter2 definitly has one mast:
<img src="http://media.moddb.com/images/mods/1/13/12307/jack_sparrow_sailing_with_thomas.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
 
Checking some further, that appears to be "Sloop_Cutter1_18", which just looks that way. For me too.
I agree it looks odd though; wonder what we should do about it.
 
Is there any model difference between the Sloop_Cutter1_18 and Cutter1/2?
 
Sloop_Cutter1_18 has a dinghy on the deck and the other two don't.
Would be better to use the Sloop_Cutter1_18 hull for the other two cutters too, then apply the cutter1/2 rigging to the Sloop_Cutter1_18.
And for simplicity's sake, we could then rename Sloop_Cutter1_18 to Cutter3_18.
 
the sailplan is just a bit messy. the mast should be placed a bit more forwards and have bigger sails.
 
I agree the mast should be abit farther forward. Cutters carried proportionally more sail than ships of similar size.

There is book on cutters "Anatomy of the Ship: The Naval Cutter Alert 1777" by Peter Goodwin ISBN 0851779689 originally published by Conway Marine press and republish the Naval Institute Press.

The book shows several different models for National Maritime Museum. It also gives deck plans, sheer plans and Sail plans.

I believe I have the book at home and could scan some of the plans if anyone is interested.

Greg.
 
well drat, i've been out-seadogged. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/389_robber.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":robber:" border="0" alt="389_robber.gif" />
 
<!--quoteo(post=333091:date=Jun 26 2009, 12:39 PM:name=bumpkin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bumpkin @ Jun 26 2009, 12:39 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=333091"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I agree the mast should be abit farther forward. Cutters carried proportionally more sail than ships of similar size.

There is book on cutters "Anatomy of the Ship: The Naval Cutter Alert 1777" by Peter Goodwin ISBN 0851779689 originally published by Conway Marine press and republish the Naval Institute Press.

The book shows several different models for National Maritime Museum. It also gives deck plans, sheer plans and Sail plans.

I believe I have the book at home and could scan some of the plans if anyone is interested.

Greg.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


Please do, Bumpkin! That would be awesome reference!

Cap'n Drow
 
<!--quoteo(post=333097:date=Jun 27 2009, 12:08 AM:name=Cap'n_Drow)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Cap'n_Drow @ Jun 27 2009, 12:08 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=333097"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Please do, Bumpkin! That would be awesome reference!

Cap'n Drow<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

I will try to get some of the images scanned this weekend about Cutters.

My library <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="xD:" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" /> also includes the two titles by Harold Hahn, "The Colonial Schooner" and "Ships of the American Revolution and their Models" seven different ships varying in size from a 14 gun sloop to the 74 gun Alfred. The anatomy of a ship series "The 20-gun ship Blanford" and "The Royal Yatch Caroline 1749". Though the last book has about 15-20 pages of text the rest of the book is all drawings. Very detailed.

Greg.
 
How does one go about uploading the files. I have the Cutter scanned, and one of the Blanford.

It does seem that Cutters can rig and auxiliary mizzen mast with a single lug sail. Though only when they have storm gaff sail and driver boom rigged.

Greg.
 
Anything in the way of descriptions, elevation or plan drawings for hulls, interiors and sail-plans would be awesome.

The more reference to get things perfect, the better in my opinion.

Cap'n Drow
 
Easiest way is to download the copy of FTP Commander floating around in the forums and downloads section.

Pieter has it already configured to connect to the PotC directories.

Just create a Bumpkin directory there and upload away.

Cap'n Drow
 
Well there is nothing wrong about that first pictured cutter mast but sure it could use a third foresail in addition. Like this, it would really not steer that well and have lots of adrift if the wind is not coming in directly from aft. But I am not totally into ship-rigging and dont know the terms in english.

Morgan, can a cutter also have a triangle topsail above that mizzensail instead of that rey-sail or would that be a sloop? Actually i cant see the difference of those two <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" />
 
i've never seen a cutter with a triangular gaff, but i don't see why it wouldn't be done. however, cutters (as is also the case with the one on the screenshot) often had a square topsail, so an extra triangular topsail would have been impractical or maybe not even possible at all. a sloop is mainly larger than a cutter, but i think that if it wouldn't have the square sail but a triangular one instead, it would be a sloop.

the triangular topsail would be a top gaff, by the way. 'topsails' are always square.
 
From the plans in the book. The topsail should would be better classified a topgallent and be a bit smaller and higher on the mast. The plans show a topsail with a upside down U shape. The top of the U just clears the forestays. The topsail overlaps the course which is mounted just above the raised position of the gaff jaws. The storm gaff looks to be about half the size of the standard gaff sail. The standard gaff should extend about 15 feet beyond the taffrail. I think you would be hard pressed to get the rig to balance with a top gaff, based on the size of the normal driver/gaff sail. There would not be enough fore sail area to counter balance the extra sail area behind the mast.

Balance is the other reason why I think the mast is to far aft. It would place the center of effort well behind the center of mass. Might work great if sailing backwards but not forward.

I will try to post the files this evening.

I did not make copies of the internal layout. The Anatomy of a Ship series of books have explicit drawings about the construction and rigging of the various sailing vessels.

I highly recommend checking with your local libraries about borrowing a copy. Many libraries do inter library loans and are connected to collegiate libraries.

Greg.
 
i thought a topgallant was rigged on a third mastpiece, not the second? judging by the cutter's rig size, it could only fit one sail underneath, which would be the mainsail.
 
Files are in POTC files/bumpkin/cutter. Sorry did not get a got copy of the topsail. I will scan one of the photos for a better description.

The hull is in two parts. Sorry do not have any tools other than paint.

Greg.
 
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