Purpose of this Forum

[Pieter Boelen]

@Cerez, the way I see it, this subforum is your personal safe space.
If you tell me what rights you need, I will set you up as Moderator here so you can set things up according to your liking.

Similar to what I'm doing with @Martes here:
[Age of Sail 2 Privateer's Bounty] Possible development

If you want to invite anyone new into your safe zone, let me know and I will add them.
For now, it remains you, me and @The Nameless Pirate.

In addition, one request from my side:
This is your place to discuss anything and here you are in charge.
In return, let's limit remarks like from the AoS 2 thread to here, Private Message or kept to yourself.

You know me. I am human and I may make mistakes. I need you to be forgiving of those.
At the same time, I generally consider virtually all my posts very well-considered.

I do not wish to have to defend myself for every single word I post in every single forum.
The way I see it, I am in charge of the entire board. You are in charge here.
That means I follow your lead here and you follow mine everywhere else.

You are a well-respected member and I want you to feel welcome and at ease here.
At the same time though, I want the same thing for myself.
I hope that sounds fair to you.

Everything is still open for negotiation at this time.
If there is anything (else) you need/want, you can always ask.

Agreed?

 

[Pieter Boelen]

People who currently have access:

- Myself (obviously)
- @The Nameless Pirate (a young lad from Greece)
- @Cerez (a girl from Tasmania close to my own age)
- @DavyJack (a girl working at sea in the US Navy)
- @A Person

 

[Cerez]

I'm confused... I thought this was our space -- for our friendship circle. You set it up based on our PMs, because you felt you needed to organise all our thoughts into separate threads we can keep track of -- and I agreed with and respect that.

I don't feel comfortable taking charge of anything here. I am just a user on this board, a modder and member of the community, and I hope a good friend.

If you feel that my publically outspoken personality is undermining or interfering with your leadership/role as admin here, then I can change my ways and stay out of things going forward. I'll interact where I feel my contributions are welcome. You don't need to create a section for me to rule here -- I have no desire for leadership.

I hope that makes sense. I consider you as leader of this community and my friend. The two are quite distinct roles in my mind.

If I'm triggering/annoying you, though, then maybe we shouldn't interact so much. We don't have to be close friends -- or at least not at this point in our lives. It's our decision, and I'm fine with whatever we decide.

Not all people get along -- and there's not always someone to blame for that. In fact, most often it's just something that happens in nature, a part of life. So if you feel that we are conflicting, and that our social interaction is not pleasant, that's okay -- we don't have to interact so much.

What are your thoughts?

 

[Cerez]

Note that I've only responded to and commented on conversations I've been previously engaged in or called by name to. I haven't really contributed elsewhere, so it's not like I am following you around to publically criticise you -- if that's the impression you got (from what I gather).

(So if you stop inviting me to future conversations, I'm not going to hound you. )

And I do appreciate your kindness and considerate replies -- as well as your own critical thinking and independent perspective/thoughts -- don't think I don't.

Sometimes I know I can be a little too forward, but that doesn't mean I don't care about you and everyone else in the conversation. In fact, I mostly point out (or criticise) and share because I worry and care. And challenging and conflict is the last thing on my mind -- I avoid them as much as I can.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

I'm confused... I thought this was our space -- for our friendship circle.

Exactly my point; I want to make sure that it stays that way.
Even though outside this space, I wish to make plenty of changes.

I want to see PA! live up to its true potential and my head is absolutely full of ideas.
If done right, I believe we can make a true impact on the world.
But that's not going to happen by keeping things static...

I don't feel comfortable taking charge of anything here. I am just a user on this board, a modder and member of the community

Fair enough. You don't have to. Certainly not right now.
Consider it a standing offer. If ever you feel like you do want to, all you have to do is ask.

If I'm triggering/annoying you, though, then maybe we shouldn't interact so much.

I am mainly concerned that I am going to be triggering you.
For example, I am not going to stop editing, moving, splitting and merging other peoples' posts.
I'll keep it to a minimum for sure and I will only ever do it if I believe there is good reason for it.
But it's part of my job to be able to do that and I have those options for a reason.

If I see trouble brewing, I will attempt to do whatever needs doing to avoid escalation.
I have zero stomach for needless strife (@Jack Rackham vs. @Grey Roger, for example).
Once I get to know members, I begin to understand how they interact and I can often predict how things are going to go.

I may miss things; sometimes I may be trigger-happy and I'll definitely make mistakes.
I am only human, after all. But everything I do, I do for what I believe is the good of the community and the good of the Earth.
(Ambitious much? Oh yes!)

It is true that you trigger me here and there as well.
I do not wish to antagonise you, but fact is that we are different people with sometimes wildly differing views.
I respect you and your views and I like to believe I understand where you're coming from.

Whatever I do, you can count that I did consider your point of view.
Still, chances are I will do things that conflict with them anyway.
Because I cannot always meet your standards as we all have to deal with a FAR less-than-perfect reality; rather than an ideal.

I want to get all of us (on this planet!) closer to our (I believe) shared ideal, but that requires some less-than-ideal paths.
For example, I would be absolutely open to cooperating with Disney.
Or bypassing them altogether. Whatever happens to be the most functional path.
I'm a pirate and my main concern is doing whatever works and whatever works.

Note that I've only responded to and commented on conversations I've been previously engaged in or called by name to. I haven't really contributed elsewhere, so it's not like I am following you around to publically criticise you -- if that's the impression you got (from what I gather).

Don't worry; that's certainly not the impression I got.
I was mainly concerned about the difference between a public and a hidden forum.
It is probably not easily apparent, but there can be massive differences from subforum to subforum.

"POTC Modding" is only available to "Storm Modders", for example.
Most of the new 'Bidness & Badness' sections are fully on a person-to-person basis.
But the rest of the website is available for literally everyone on the internet; often even without any https encryption at all.

Sometimes I know I can be a little too forward, but that doesn't mean I don't care about you and everyone else in the conversation. In fact, I mostly point out (or criticise) and share because I worry and care. And challenging and conflict is the last thing on my mind -- I avoid them as much as I can.

I know that. And that's why, whatever you say, I do appreciate you for sharing your viewpoint.
After all, I love people DISagreeing with me because I'm going to need people I trust and who trust me to hold me accountable.

But that is something I do prefer to happen in private.
And I don't want to have the discussions going round in the same circles either.

I hope a good friend.

You ARE a good friend. Not only do you disagree with me but, unlike most, you tell me WHY!
That is truly valuable in my book and that's why I trust you and value you.
No matter what happens.

And that's why I want to ensure that no matter what happens,
no matter how close or distant things may get, you will always have a home here.

I hope that makes sense.

 

[Cerez]

Understood. Thanks Pieter.

You are right, while we have certain things in common, there is much that you and I see very differently. This is a community under your leadership, and ultimately your decision.

I am going to take a bit of a step-back in terms of activity here, simply because I saw something else in the spirit of this community -- a different promise/potential. That and my life has enough chaos at the moment that I need reliability/stability above all else.

I'll just share with you in private here that while I respect your choice, I don't actually agree with any of choices you've made above regarding the future of the community here -- but you probably already knew that, based on our open discussions so far. I think activity in a stable and accountable environment these days is more important than (radical) change (which is a neurotypical trend/concept), that each individual should have the freedom to be accountable for their own actions (with minimal intervention and no censoring), and that the end doesn't justify the means.

If you choose to take the Disney approach, then I will likely be forced into silence. I've seen it happen in a few different communities before. Open criticism is not welcome when it comes to despotic business rule. Disney doesn't appreciate criticism of their company, products, and ways.

I was mainly concerned about the difference between a public and a hidden forum.
It is probably not easily apparent, but there can be massive differences from subforum to subforum.

"POTC Modding" is only available to "Storm Modders", for example.
Most of the new 'Bidness & Badness' sections are fully on a person-to-person basis.
But the rest of the website is available for literally everyone on the internet; often even without any https encryption at all.

I have to admit that this is indeed very confusing to the user -- and that I've posted responded to threads I had no idea where on the board they were actually located before. Perhaps colour coding the forums per permission/exposure level, along with using a symbol for each different level (for colour-blind users) would help. Just a suggestion for the future.

Or clearly organising/grouping the forums by permission/exposure level, from public to private. But even with that it would still be confusing when people jump from thread to thread because their name has been called or they've received a new post/response in a previous thread.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

I am going to take a bit of a step-back in terms of activity here, simply because I saw something else in the spirit of this community -- a different promise/potential.

I wonder what potential you saw.
I find it difficult to believe what you saw differs much from what I do.
After all, I came here because I liked the spirit here.
And I aim to keep that spirit alive.

That and my life is enough chaos at the moment that I need reliability/stability above all else.

My life is nutty chaos too.
In part because professionally "this community doesn't count" for some mad, mad reason.
I have zero intention of creating more chaos.
I do have the intention to create growth.

I'll just share with you in private here that while I respect your choice, I don't agree with any of choices you've made above regarding the future of the community -- but you probably already knew that.

This is the time where you can voice them.
There is no course set. We're in this boat all together.

I think activity in a stable and accountable environment is more important than change, that each individual should have the freedom to be accountable for their own actions (with minimal intervention and no censoring), and that the ends doesn't justify the means.

Most people cannot see the consequences of their actions.
Leading to astronomonical amounts of 'counter-helping'.
In my life for sure, that has accumulated to be bordering on the 'absolutely lethal' level.
And I need this to stop.

I need rules to be followed and I will enforce them.
I need people to be truly considerate of others.
Anarchy does not work and that's not going to happen under my command.

Also, I value my independence and I could
sarcrifice that.
I will also fight tooth and nail to protect this for others.

IF any cooperation with Disney is going to happen, they will do what WE want and not the other way around.
I'm thinking along the lines of Pixar or National Geograhic.
Green shipping in real life and practical education of people.

Idealism alone will not save this world.
It'll take action too and that requires being realistic first.
For example, running a website doesn't do itself.
It requires hardware, people and probably money to smoothen things out here and there.

This will be a big experiment of mine and we'll continue to have to course-correct; find out what works and what doesn't.
But we'll always be pirates at heart.
Of the Pastafarian holy kind.

I have to admit that this is indeed very confusing to the user. Perhaps colour coding the forums per permission/exposure level, along with using a symbol for each different level (for colour-blind users, would help. Just a suggestion for the future.

Or clearly organising/grouping the forums by permission/exposure level, from public to private. But even with that it would still be confusing when people jump from thread to thread because their name has been called or they're received a new post/response in a previous thread.

I wouldn't know how to do that. Will have to find out.
Plenty of Admin work ahead, I suppose.
And a lot of trial-and-error too...

 

[Cerez]

I wonder what potential you saw.
I find it difficult to believe what you saw differs much from what I do.
After all, I came here because I liked the spirit here.
And I aim to keep that spirit alive.

It's hard to explain in short, and I'm low on resources -- I would need to dedicate an entire discussion to it -- but this is still a fairly infantile community in regards to its social rules and structure, with much potential to grow in any direction. From our advanced, considerate conversations, what I saw was a mature and responsible community slowly developing, where the rules are drafted to address everyone's natural needs and where users follow and socially encourage/enforce those rules because they feel/know it is in the best interest of everyone.

Such a community can exist -- it's not too ideal and far from reality -- if done right. (I had built such a smaller community with careful planning and open feedback from my members in the past.) But it takes much practice and experience, as the behaviour of people is far from easy to predict. And it takes a delicate balance to enforce authority and exercise control when really needed, but to not intrude upon people's freedoms, and to let them express themselves freely without hurting each other.

I've also evidently misinterpreted the unchanging nature of the site/board design and structure as an appreciation for stability and a deliberate move against fast-moving commercial trends -- a site built not for business, but for the community, for the best interest of its members as people (fundamentally for a humanitarian cause).

In part because professionally "this community doesn't count" for some mad, mad reason.

Whoever made that comment is oblivious to how communities work. This is an open community by purpose/design, not a professional/commercial digital platform. That doesn't mean that one can't find professional business connections here, between community members.

Or did they mean that the forum software doesn't meet modern standards? (Which, again, is debatable -- as it's not that out of date. )

 

[The Nameless Pirate]

I wonder what potential you saw.
I find it difficult to believe what you saw differs much from what I do.
After all, I came here because I liked the spirit here.
And I aim to keep that spirit alive.

It's hard to explain in short, and I'm low on resources -- I would need to dedicate an entire discussion to it -- but this is still a fairly infantile community in regards to its social rules and structure, with much potential to grow in any direction. From our advanced conversations, what I saw was a mature and responsible community slowly developing, where the rules are drafted to address everyone's natural needs and where users follow and enforce those rules because they feel/know it is in the best interest of everyone.

Such a community can exist -- it's not too ideal and far from reality -- if done right. (I had built such a smaller community in the past.) But it takes much practice and experience, as the behaviour of people is far from easy to predict. And it takes a delicate balance to enforce authority and exercise control when needed, but to not intrude upon people's freedoms, and to let them express themselves freely without hurting each other.

I've also evidently misinterpreted the unchanging nature of the site/board design and structure as an appreciation for stability and a deliberate move against fast-moving commercial trends -- a site built not for business, but for the community, for the best interest of its members as people (fundamentally for a humanitarian cause).

I saw a friendly community of people that love pirates as much as I do.

That's a HUGE simplification, true; but as Bri said, in order to give it more detail a separate discussion would be best.