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Russian vs. western gamers

Pieter Boelen

Pieter Boelen

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As Mr. Zaitsev says:
In Russia exists opinion that Russian cannot doing games for the West. Even if game becomes for the western gamers, just the same it turns out "Russian". Russians game's experts think that the western gamer is casual, whereas Russian is hardcore. Personally I think that if to play interestingly, just the same what nation of the gamer. First of all I would like to learn your opinion about CoAS as it is range for our decisions of design.
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Cap'n_Drow doesn't believe there is any real differences between the two groups of gamers, but I do observe at least one quanitifiable difference:
In Russia there is DOZENS of people developing and modding pirate games, but in the western world not so much.
So what ARE the differences and how might a pirate game be set up to cater to both audiences?
ARE there even two audiences or are we basically just all the same, as Cap'n_Drow suggests?
 
Russians game's experts think that the western gamer is casual, whereas Russian is hardcore.
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Hardcore titles here don't tend to attract the mass market. Yes, there are a lot of us who like them, but nothing like the number of casual gamers who prefer an arcade experience. Many companies have found out the hard way that producing a title that only appeals to the hard core gamer won't bring in enough to justify development costs.

One company only had 8500 sales on one very good hardcore game. How many hardcore titles have appealed to the mass market? I can think of a couple, but it's a tough nut for a developer to crack.

Of course, if the game is successful in Russia, then as long as the game sells enough in the rest of the world to cover translation expenses, etc, and give some profit, then it should be good.

Hook
 
So are the Russian gamers more hardcore than the western ones?
And if so, is it possible to make a game that both hardcore gamers (read: Russian) and casual gamers (read: western) would both be willing to play?
What would the "Russian hardcore pirate gamer that would be interested in Corsairs 4" be like?
 
When SD came out and I tried to get on the Akella forum I found most of the Russians had a huge chip on their shoulder.

Gamewise, apart from the translation issue's there is really nothing else.

If I had to say something, I think western games are easier to play out of the box than Russian games. But that is probably more along the lines of casual vs hc.

Sad to say, but I think C4 should lean towards more casual, with the modding ability to become hardcore (Possibly a nice PA! tie in there)
 
"chip on their shoulder" = "A perceived grievance or sense of inferiority"?
Do you mean the Russian gamers considered themselves inferior to the western ones? Or the Russian game developers?
 
Nah the developers I dealt with at Akella were fine.

It's the community in general (probably the players, not the modders) who had a problem with anyone asking something in english.
 
The Russian gamers didn't like the English-speaking gamers or the Russian gamers felt inferior/superior to the English-speaking gamers?
 
I think it is the world wide problem that English speakers, in the majority, do not try to learn any other language, but expect others to learn English, which is perceived as arrogant and lazy.

In the English speakers defense, I think because English can be mutilated and still be understood.
"bread cheese piece want I"
is understandable as
"I want a piece of bread and cheese"
As an English speaker - and therefore no expert on other languages <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="xD:" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" /> - I don't think the same mutilation can take place in other languages and be as easily understood.
 
I like having one language that "most" people understand. Even if it isn't Dutch.
 
Brood kaas stuk ik wil (same sentence in Dutch)
Brot Käse Stück ich will (same sentence in German)

Maybe it is possible with all Germanic languages.
 
I think one of the biggest differences between Russian and western players also manifests it's self in chess. I have never played a Russian, but I have studied certain Russian chess players. This may be a bit of a generalization and certainly doesn't apply to everyone, but i think Russian players are more methodical and calculating then western players, and especially American chess players. They take time to analyze a situation in depth. Chess players as a general rule do that, but Russians seem to just do it better. Western players, and Americans in particular, have more of a tendency to react more quickly without that thorough analysis. They tend to react more on instinct.

As Hook mentioned in another thread, ship to ship battles are very similar to a chess game, that is one of the things I enjoy most about pirate games.
 
Well, from what I have been seeing in this thread, I'd say that everyone perceives a difference, but the general consensus seems to be that our player community tends to be more like the Russian gamers than the average western player.

Personally I still feel that there are player types of both forms on either side of the longitude lines of this particular discussion.

So what does everyone feel is the reason for this apparent difference in the gamers of east and west?

Cap'n Drow
 
So what does everyone feel is the reason for this apparent difference in the gamers of east and west?
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Diet. Television. MTV. Exposure to actual culture instead of pop culture. The way people feel about their lives in general. Different priorities. Differing acceptance of what is or isn't frivolous or important. Differing expectations of achievement, or even what constitutes achievement. I could go on.

Different cultures are different. Sometimes very different. Did you know that the Japanese language contains no swear words? It's only recently that young people have picked them up from other languages and imported them. There's a culture of politeness there.

In Russia that culture is... culture. Chess. Ballet. Whatever.

An interesting thing I saw once... someone gave my son a Playmobil electric train set. On the box, in different languages, were the age at which children could be given the toy. That age was different for each language, within the range of ages they had. Different cultures are different.

Hook
 
Personally I still feel that there are player types of both forms on either side of the longitude lines of this particular discussion.
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I agree totally Cap'n_Drow! There are many serious game players in the west that are very good at in depth analysis, and there are many on these forums. Just as there are many Russian players that do react more on instinct. I think Hook is on to something with his post, it's all about culture, and the experiences we are exposed to on a daily basis. Western culture, American in particular, over the past 30 years or so has become more of an instant gratification society. So much so, it is almost as if they feel they are entitled or owed something, instead of having to work hard to earn something they want.

I can only speak from my own experiences, and I have personally seen this type of attitude repeatedly in my job related experiences the past 25 years or so. The younger a new worker is, the more likely they are to only last a few days or a couple of weeks at a new job. They are unwilling to put in the time and effort it takes to learn how to do a job properly, and earn the raises and benefits that come with longevity and quality production. They want the big pay off now. Again, this is a generalization and does not apply to everyone, I have seen younger workers that are willing to put in the effort, but they are becoming more and more of an exception.
 
i think society in general is getting more and more spoiled. we live in a fast food, high speed internet, movies on demand, microwave world and peoples attitudes in general show it few and fewer have any patience for waiting or working hard to get something.

never known any russians directly tho to compare however so not sure how far back they are in these trends, but it is certainly a trend i have seen over here from my first mmo days when they took actually work and effort to level and get stuff, and people were for the most part friendly considerate and helpful, vs recent years where the trends have gotten worse and worse. they want it easier and quicker now days.

heck i can barely stand the grind mmo after a certain point, where my first mmo was almost entirely grind and i spent 5 years playing that game to get better, get stronger and see the new content. not entirely sure if it is my age or the culture we live in ruining that drive, or the games themselves are just that lacking in any real content or lore to drive that urge to play.
 
I think its bullshit.
there exists no difference between eastern/western gamers.

the western gamer play more mmo´s/ egoshooter because there exists no interesting in pirate games at the moment. For us is CoAS interesting but for the most gamers it is not complete and only of the first view interesting and than it would be boring.

the western gamer needs a huge world, thousand options to create a character and a many, many weapons for all hands and feets. look at the corsairs 4 discussions.

the eastern gamer is happy about that what CoAS gives.

i think a pirate game must be more published in th west!!
 
I can't speak for gaming differencies, but modding-wise I can:
Russians treat developers who released a modpack as authorities - developers doing it for a living = gods.

I googled their communities - there are a lot, and lots more than we think - some moddingteams actually waited several months in line for a meeting with Seaward.ru, so they could sign a NDA for an open programs folder. Youp, thats right. We would not stick with that...Neither would any of us put up with the strict hierachi with "Admirals" ruling the forums and "cadets" doing all the boring work. Of course, they ended up "sharing" the program folder, leaked in the western release and this signing became obsolete. Also, the russians would rather have old tools, with tutorials explained by one of their own, than have the latest files and read a tutorial in english. They have a very accurate and deep knowledge on naval history in general, not only their own, as they have documents and sources translated to russian laid out on their forums. They have to follow these documents. I suspect, the US Virgin Islands is not on the worldmap, because there are no information about these and the Denmark-Norway are described as a punic seafarer nation who could not beat Sweden, so Russia had to enter the First Great Nordic War. On the other hand, the unsettled Santa Lucia islands are covered in every aspect - these may have been the foundation for khael roa o_O

Although PA! are considered tiny and annoying because we do steal their stuff and do not translate our mod into russian, we are unknown to most forums.

The other way around is complex, because russian IP-filters need authorization, if you are a foreigner. So you can't just download their stuff or become a member of their forums, you have to wait for authorization. But they can come in here and grap anything.

All forums seem to mod for AoP and CoAS, the PotC forums are generally not updated with new content. Language makes the difference before culture and I conclude, it makes a barrier for us.
 
well some mods on ru forums are put on places you need to have an account to get, some are put up for free for all download, yea you have to wade thru and find which are which, but some western forums are the same way, you need an account to download file linked on some forums.

got a some mods off ru forums, but many are put on site you need an account to download, not unlike fileplanet links and such, just mostly in the west someone will grab those and upload them to other places because people ask. maybe in russia those account places are just used more or are more reliable and we miss out because we do not speak read or type russian lol, nor do our browsers handle their sites so well.
 
But the difference is, we give credit, for what we nick. The russians au contraire, come here, get what they like and then are gone with the wind. And give no credit at all. With the biggest one of them all: OUR BLACK PEARL! Kazeite gave permission to use it in the SotFS mod. But now all modders there use it and upload it without even mentioning Kazeite.

So WE aren't the only thiefs.
 
But the difference is, we give credit, for what we nick. The russians au contraire, come here, get what they like and then are gone with the wind. And give no credit at all. With the biggest one of them all: OUR BLACK PEARL! Kazeite gave permission to use it in the SotFS mod. But now all modders there use it and upload it without even mentioning Kazeite.

So WE aren't the only thiefs.
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well i dunno about that stuff, sucks if that is the case.
 
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