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Batavia buildplans?

Coen

Coen

Landlubber
Hi guys,

Can anyone provide build plans for the dutch Batavia? I'm currently doing a project where we are gonna have to build her in Maya. So far I've only encountered sites which require payment. Me being a student, I cant really afford that.

I'd be eternally grateful and perhaps, when she's done, the model can be used for HOOCOTS or GOF?

PS: not sure about this post being in the right forum section, but since currently it's not related to any of the mods I didn't know where to put this request.
 
I doubt that they provide them for free when other sites require payment. I'll try though. It's just that, I saw someone on this forum saying he/she had obtained the plans, however I cant find that post anymore...
 
Perhaps somebody indeed does, but I'm not sure.
If you offer them the use of your finished model, perhaps they'll be interested? Could serve as some good promotional material for them, no? :cheeky
 
Yeah, except we're already in talks with Het Scheepvaart Museum (Amsterdam), had a concept presentation today.

Could still try it though. But we're not even sure if we are really going to do something concerning the Batavia. I was just researching if it was at all possible to get her buildplans.
 
Hmm.... If you accidentally find yourself in a position to get the plans of the Amsterdam, that would be VERY interesting.
 
That is a great book! I have it hardcover. Bava is correct. That pinnace is close to the Batavia. I for one would love to see an accurate Batavia in our games! Wish I had those plans. I have been putting together a Flickr set for Batavia for quite some time. I have enough images to post now but haven't hung them up yet. Plans in that set would be very nice.

MK
 
Couldn't get access to the MUSE project files. We're going into a different direction with the project and it's pretty likely I won't need the buildplans anymore. However I'm still wondering what kind of shiptype the Batavia is? The only terms I could find are VOC Retour Ship or Spiegel Retour Schip, or just the general term Indiamen or Oostindiëvaarder.

Thanks for the help guys,
 
I always thought of her as a Fluyt, but Wikipedia suggests that I somehow made that up myself. o_O
 
Well, a pinas ship like the Batavia is essentially a fluyt, but modified to allow for larger travel distances (Europe - India - Europe). And the name 'spiegel retour ship' simply describes it function as an east-indiaman. The 'spiegel' part most probably is a reference to the much larger transom compared to a fluyt.
 
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Batavia is not a Fluyt. Remember that fluyts ALWAYS have rounded sterns - not flat or notched Galleon type sterns as we see on Batavia. Fluyts also have very small amounts of deck space comparable to other ship types and were known for only needing a handful of crew to man. There are some rare exceptions seen in paintings of well armed fluyts, but typically they had very little armament if any.

If we want to use correct Dutch classification then spiegel and retour can be appropriately applied to an Indiaman, but in more general terms, Batavia is simply a type of Galleon class ship.

Remember also that fluyts were not generally global vessels. Fluyts were much more localized with the majority used in the North Sea and Baltic trade routes. There were several unique variants of fluyts: timber, whaling, and cargo. The cargo variants carried everything - but salted herring would have been one of the primary cargoes. We also know from period lading documents that fluyts were used to a lesser extent in the Biscay region and in the Atlantic trade routes, however, they were not generally ships that saw journeys or service in the East. I recently unearthed a fascinating and rare painting of the bustling river harbor of mid 17th century Seville. Conspicuous are two fluyts at the warfs with Spanish colors. They are noticeably smaller than the Galleons that are the main focus of the piece.

Batavia as a East Indiaman of the 1620-30 era is a galleon and much larger than most fluyts. She is also fairly well armed for a cargo carrier. This was because the VOC mandated a certain amount of armament on its ships, not only so that they could defend themselves against Dunkirk pirates/privateers, but also against threats in the East and on the journey. In addition, VOC (retour) ships were often pressed into military service in time of war. The fluyt was not a warship and would rarely be pressed into military service.

Take a look at my Flickr set here to see some good examples of these types of ships: http://www.flickr.com/photos/49225014@N05/sets/72157632563658303/

I am hanging a fluyt set today. EDIT: here it is... http://www.flickr.com/photos/49225014@N05/sets/72157636152714623/

MK
 
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Bava said:
The 'spiegel' part most probably is a reference to the much larger transom compared to a fluyt.
Click to expand...
The "spiegel" of a ship is just the "flat" part of the stern. It is a term still in use even on modern vessels.
The reason for it being in the name is because it is highly decorated on these types of ships.

modernknight1 said:
Batavia is not a Fluyt.
Click to expand...
Thanks for confirming and explaining. Not sure where that idea of mine comes from, but I know now that it isn't true.
 
Pieter Boelen said:
The "spiegel" of a ship is just the "flat" part of the stern. It is a term still in use even on modern vessels.
The reason for it being in the name is because it is highly decorated on these types of ships.

Thanks for confirming and explaining. Not sure where that idea of mine comes from, but I know now that it isn't true.
Click to expand...

My pleasure Pieter,

I have been meaning to hang this set for sometime just hadn't got around to it. I wanted to make a point of this because this is a mistake that a lot of people make. From the bow and sideviews there are similarities in appearance. I have corrected this mis-classification in numerous conversations on this forum and others for a number of years.

Here's the new set for fluyts. http://www.flickr.com/photos/49225014@N05/sets/72157636152714623/

MK
 
You only need these two design documents. Pieter is right.
You have to get sale in Batavia shipyard. With this small donation, help you get the Batavia and build the 7 Province.
 
Most interesting. I knew the Batavia wasn't a Fluyt. A type of galleon is indeed more logical. That still means we don't actually know right? BTW how's the current standing with tradeships like the Batavia in both the GOF, the latest POTC Build and Hearts of Oak? It seems to me that there are way more warships being added than any other kind. I too love my Sixth Rates and Third Rates and the occasional First Rate. But it be much more logical to have more tradeships then warships on the high seas...
 
I'm thinking of finishing my Cutter and maybe even more ships after that, maybe with a focus on tradeships then.
 
GOF has plenty of ships of all types and time periods in it, so there is a good variety there.

POTC is split up into many different time periods, so what ship you want to sail determines what time period you choose. If you want to sail a Carrack you choose Early Explorers. If you want to sail a steam frigate you choose Revolutions.

HOO has very little content yet so nothing can be said.

The only Batavia model is an old inaccurate model in POTC and a new model would be most welcome.
 
Coen said:
BTW how's the current standing with tradeships like the Batavia in both the GOF, the latest POTC Build and Hearts of Oak?
Click to expand...
The Batavia in PotC just plain sucks. She isn't the Batavia anyway, just an under-detailed model from Voyage Century Online.
I'd be quite happy to see a proper one!

We do have various trade vessels, but indeed warships are more commonly added. I welcome all new ships, especially ones that are NOT similar to ones we've already got.
 
Sorry, but Batavia is not a galleon. Retourship, a name is there only from the 18th century for such vessels.
 
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