PotC Build Mod Ship Cleanup

[Armada]

There's a couple of things you may want to update:

• Most transparent window issues have been resolved
• Have you seen the new FR_SuperiorWarship1 texture, to decide if it's worth keeping? (And we could even copy the other ship's extra details across)
• There are a couple of ships marked 'drop' which have been improved lately (e.g. FastGalleon2)
• Any news from Jack Harrison on his new and fixed Surprise models?
• I don't know why you want to drop the HeavyWarship models...

Apart from that, are there any stock ships we definitely want to drop because there are too many textures of them?
I'd like to know so that I can avoid them when improving the rigging. :hmm
And do we have any modellers around willing to start on some brand-new replacements ships?

 

[Pieter Boelen]

•Have you seen the new FR_SuperiorWarship1 texture, to decide if it's worth keeping? (And we could even copy the other ship's extra details across)

The new texture definitly increases the reasons to keep her. Not sure if we should though, since it's still two French versions of the same ship.
Anyway, I'm not deciding anything until next weekend, because I'm going on a five-day holiday tomorrow.

•There are a couple of ships marked 'drop' which have been improved lately (e.g. FastGalleon2)

FastGalleon2 doesn't look particularly bad. We could keep her, though we do have three skins of that same ship.

•Any news from Jack Harrison on his new and fixed Surprise models?

He posts his news on the forum, so when I know, you'll know.

•I don't know why you want to drop the HeavyWarship models...

That one looks to me like another RN retexture of the... is it the lineship?
Anyway, it's a RN texture of a stock game ship anyway and I think we might want to do away with a couple of those.

Apart from that, are there any stock ships we definitely want to drop because there are too many textures of them?

I think we might go ahead and keep all stock game ship models simply because they're there already anyway.
Then we could replace their textures if we've got better ones though.
I think the Warship model has the highest chance of being removed, because that's the old Fearless that wasn't even ever used in the original game.
Maybe even the game developers thought that one was a bit unfinished/substandard-like?
But anyway, I'd prefer other people to make the final decisions since it's not generally me playing the game!

 

[Armada]

The new texture definitly increases the reasons to keep her. Not sure if we should though, since it's still two French versions of the same ship.
Anyway, I'm not deciding anything until next weekend, because I'm going on a five-day holiday tomorrow.

I suppose you're right there, and we should keep the other one. I think FR_SW1 is used in the standard storyline though- we'd better ensure the code is changed!

Five-day holiday? Where you going?
I wish I could call this half-term break a 'holiday', but really it's an excuse for me to be overwhelmed with homework from college.

FastGalleon2 doesn't look particularly bad. We could keep her, though we do have three skins of that same ship.

True, we do need to keep multiple textures to a minimum.

He posts his news on the forum, so when I know, you'll know.

OK then, I'll wait a little longer. I'm pretty sure he's just waiting for someone to make a sailorspoints file, but I certainly can't do THAT.

That one looks to me like another RN retexture of the... is it the lineship?
Anyway, it's a RN texture of a stock game ship anyway and I think we might want to do away with a couple of those.

It's more than a re-texture; it's a 74-Gun custom version, and so is the US one. Particularly useful in the last couple of periods, I think.

I think we might go ahead and keep all stock game ship models simply because they're there already anyway.
Then we could replace their textures if we've got better ones though.
I think the Warship model has the highest chance of being removed, because that's the old Fearless that wasn't even ever used in the original game.
Maybe even the game developers thought that one was a bit unfinished/substandard-like?
But anyway, I'd prefer other people to make the final decisions since it's not generally me playing the game!

Good points there, but you've actually marked several stock ship re-textures as 'drop', and don't forget we've got umpteen battleships, corvettes, frigates...
I agree with removing the warship; the lineship practically does the same job, and looks better anyway.
And of course, we do need a few more opinions here! Else this wouldn't be a true representation of our community's opinions.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

I suppose you're right there, and we should keep the other one. I think FR_SW1 is used in the standard storyline though- we'd better ensure the code is changed!

I'm intending to check all code files to references to the ship models I'll be removing and renaming to make sure it'll remain working.
However, mistakes with this can easily happen. I'll try my best to avoid them, but we might have to end up fixing some afterwards.

Five-day holiday? Where you going?

Just to some small town in the Netherlands with my family. There might be internet access there and there might not be, so I'm not sure if I'll be here until Saturday.

True, we do need to keep multiple textures to a minimum.

Then the question is: which ones do we keep? And why?

OK then, I'll wait a little longer. I'm pretty sure he's just waiting for someone to make a sailorspoints file, but I certainly can't do THAT.

You can't be doing everything. It's an honourable intention to do everything, but it just doesn't work.

It's more than a re-texture; it's a 74-Gun custom version, and so is the US one. Particularly useful in the last couple of periods, I think.

If you think she's worth keeping, then she is.
Maybe you should take my file and make some adjustments as you see fit over the next week or so.
Then when I get back, I can get to work based on that. Only if you want to, though, of course.

Good points there, but you've actually marked several stock ship re-textures as 'drop', and don't forget we've got umpteen battleships, corvettes, frigates...

I'm not 100% sure of which ones we should keep and which ones not. Personally I'm not too favourable of most stock game textures,
so we could replace those with ones of ours. Anyway, if there's certain textures you'd like to keep, just name them and we can do that.

And of course, we do need a few more opinions here! Else this wouldn't be a true representation of our community's opinions.

Seconded, thirded and fourthed! I very much welcome community input!

 

[Armada]

There might be internet access there and there might not be, so I'm not sure if I'll be here until Saturday.

If you're not here, we'll cope, I'm sure. If there's anyone that needs a break, of all of us, it's you.

You can't be doing everything. It's an honourable intention to do everything, but it just doesn't work.

Very true. What I meant to say was that I would if I could, just to see that new ship released.
Does anyone think the new Surprise should be released even without crew? A new, crew-less ship is better than no new ship, right?

Maybe you should take my file and make some adjustments as you see fit over the next week or so.
Then when I get back, I can get to work based on that. Only if you want to, though, of course.

I've already downloaded a copy, so I can make the adjustments for you.

I'm not 100% sure of which ones we should keep and which ones not. Personally I'm not too favourable of most stock game textures,
so we could replace those with ones of ours. Anyway, if there's certain textures you'd like to keep, just name them and we can do that.

Well there are some stock textures which do seem a bit ugly, but I reckon we should keep most of the ones featured in the battle interface pictures, to avoid confusion there.
Any others which look worse, I think we can drop, provided that ship has at least two textures remaining, for variety's sake.

 

[Hylie Pistof]

You are asking for opinions.............

I really have no opinion on the large class 3,2,1 ships since I rarely see them. I don't like warship11 because, unless it has been worked on recently, you can't move around on it or see over the rails plus it has no crew. It appears the walk file on the light east indiaman has been worked on, but it has no crew. I won't touch it again;will anyone else? Ships that are repaints of several others can go, and low rez ships like the Sirius with its 2d handrails too. Kinda like the figurehead tho.

 

[Armada]

Warship11 has got to go, too many problems with that one.
The light east indiamen (NL_Batavia1 and 2), along with Sirius1 are low-detail and have issues with the 3rd person camera (I think). And they have no crew.
So they should go too, but as Pieter has pointed out, Batavia2 has a really nice custom texture. But the way I see it, a good texture can't disguise a bad ship.
As for that figurehead you like, it's a separate GM file, so we could potentially re-use it somewhere else. Same with Batavia2.
I might just go and edit the ships list I made a while ago, and remove Pieter's current suggested 'drop' ships, and see how it looks.
Bearing in mind that's 53 ships so far!

 

[Seb]

For my twoo cents, I would say that I can't stand anymore the stock game lineships ("blackpearl" copies) and the stock game manowars, the AOP lineships and manowars aren't better, those types simply represent bathtubs to my eyes ^^

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Does anyone think the new Surprise should be released even without crew? A new, crew-less ship is better than no new ship, right?

I do think so, yes. Anything that's released is better than anything that isn't. Later updates can always be made, but at least it won't get lost.

Well there are some stock textures which do seem a bit ugly, but I reckon we should keep most of the ones featured in the battle interface pictures, to avoid confusion there.
Any others which look worse, I think we can drop, provided that ship has at least two textures remaining, for variety's sake.

Feel free to make some notes of which textures we could drop and which ones we'd want to keep for whatever reason.

I don't like warship11 because [...] you can't move around on it or see over the rails plus it has no crew. [...] and low rez ships like the Sirius with its 2d handrails too.

I think both of these are VCO ships that we're definitly intending to drop.

For my twoo cents, I would say that I can't stand anymore the stock game lineships ("blackpearl" copies) and the stock game manowars, the AOP lineships and manowars aren't better, those types simply represent bathtubs to my eyes ^^

I don't like them much either. Though the PotC lineships got a bit nicer in Patch 4 since Experienced Captain did some texture and flag work on them. Still, they're far from the best models we've got.
Actually, which really large ships do we have that ARE worthwhile? Pgargon's HMS Victory is the only one I can think of by the top of me head.

 

[Seb]

The Superbe and the Bellona from the same author could enter in that category, the NL_Convoiship is also a big one, along with the NL_Lineship, it's just too bad redoctober's Soleil Royal doesn't fit to POTC, it could have filled a gap. We have the Couronne and maybe the treasure Galleon...

All of those ships are kinda large, but they cover different periods...

We could take in account that, in the early periods, before the beginning of the XVIIIe th century, large ships such as Manowars are rare in the caribbean if my memory doesn't fail. We have to wait the years 1710-1720 to see them appear progressively in those waters for the protection of the merchant convoys. Before that period, if I remember correctly, large vessels are rare in the antillas except for the spanish maybe, and other nations prefer giving a lot of letters of marque to arm corsairs on medium vessels.

Playing on that fact could save us from some headaches and increase the historic realism of the game?

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Could do, yes. Though we have to consider players need to be able to keep destroying forts if they want to.
So basically, we could use some truly big new ship models?

 

[Armada]

It's worth noting that pgargon's Victory actually has two more textures (red and white, as opposed to yellow), so she could potentially be used as a generic ship for more than just England.
Especially since I've just done some texture work on her (including removing the nameplate). I'll show you the details soon.

Another point is that we'd like a movie accurate Endeavour/Dauntless at some point...

 

[Armada]

•Have you seen the new FR_SuperiorWarship1 texture, to decide if it's worth keeping? (And we could even copy the other ship's extra details across)

The new texture definitly increases the reasons to keep her. Not sure if we should though, since it's still two French versions of the same ship.

Just going back to this for a minute, I think I've got an idea.
I've recently been busy behind-the-scenes improving the texture and rigging of RN_Warship, to include stay sails, similar to the Bellona.
Since this is the same model as FR_SuperiorWarship2, I thought it might be good to copy the new rigging to that ship too.
If this is done, FR_SuperiorWarship1 is then no longer an exact copy of the other model.
I was even thinking of giving it the original Battleship rigging, the extra details for FR_SW2, and using the old texture, to make the model more historically accurate when used as Belette in the NH storyline.
I understand Seb's new texture is meant to be more accurate, but it doesn't fit in with the other ships in the battle fleet in NH storyline.
Having tried the idea in-game, it looks pretty good. So if we used this system, SW1 would be and earlier ship than SW2, thus giving each one a distinct purpose.
What do you reckon?

[attachment=5689:FR_SW1_new.jpg]

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Works for me, mate.

 

[Armada]

Very well, I'll be sure to upload the changes when I'm done!
But when I adjusted the encounter code in ships_init, I looked around and discovered that there are a LOT of inaccurate encounter periods and nations, for a LOT of ships!
I'll have a look over the next few days, and see if I can apply some historical reasoning to some of these ships.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Thanks a lot, mate!

 

[morgan terror]

couldn't we put up a poll with images of the textures to vote for which ones go out? although i understand that reducing download size would be good, i rather like the large variety.

what kind of historical inaccuracies? i remember giving quite a bit of input on that, although that didn't include the newer ships. i do have to say that the 1690's have a very odd collection though.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

A poll for 200+ ships would be a bit confusing, but have a look at the opening post's attachment and post your comments based on that.
All input is much appreciated.

 

[morgan terror]

the names mean absolutely nothing to me, unfortunately.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

This file by miklkit contains screenshots of all ships: http://forum.piratesahoy.net/topic/16787-interface-screenshots-for-ships/page__view__findpost__p__382104
And the GM Viewer is always an option to check what the ships look like.
Your input would be much appreciated for sure.